We didn't help our game but sutton certainly helped souffs.

dman, yell louder. Hutchison out, Sexton in. Ciraldo might finally hear you.

I agree, the good point that Ciro mentioned is that we dominated field position and had plenty of chances. 

Ciro pit it down to execution, if we broaden  that to include intent and energy that covers it.

Ciro mentioned that we had energy in the last 5 minutes when trailing 20-12, but we needed that earlier. 

We need to stand a bit deeper, move the ball faster and run harder. Too many times a player got the ball flat footed, had nothing on and just ambled forward often finishing close to the tryline. Running harder and winning the collision would create more opportunities.

Then we really overdid Marhoney passing to Mann to Hutch who was often in space, but didn't have the pace to capitalise. Mostly run was the right decision but he was too slow.

Salmon in the centres stuffed up a try Kiks would have scored and also dropped a pass Burto should not have thrown.

As for the ref he was even worse than our attack. 

Lots that we can improve, just need to do it.

Best part was that Taaffe had by far his best game and added something to the attack.

Hutch and Mann very poor but better other weeks.

Marhoney also took a few dumb options.

Salmon, Mann and Hutch all in the same size improves our defence and versatility, but at times they stifle the attack.

We need to drop one of them.

Roosters have powerful backrowers, if Sexton plays he will need to aim up in defence. The best prep is tackling  Kiks in opposed sessions.  2 out of 3 is a pass mark, I don't expect him to stop Kiks everytime

Anyone know how Sexton went in reserve grade?

Sexy was ok in reserves but his goal kicking nearly let us down. In 1st grade Taaffe needs to learn to run straight and maybe to ½ and Connor Tracey to FB

Burton, Taafee and Crichton can all kick goals.

The spine hasn't been that bad, but something about the hooker/ lock / half combination isn't working in attack..

We either change the half or totally rethink lock.

The NSW Cup team won on the death with a great run from Bronson Xerri and a great pass as well. We were screwed big time by Sutton...none more so than the Souths player not getting binned for a professional foul. Yet, check out the glee and speed which Sutton sent Morrin to the bin. Murray did a Josh Reynolds in that play and was rewarded for it. Penalty every day of the week for the hip drop tackle on Preston. Late tackle penalty which led to Souths first try would be let go 90% of the time. 

No reason to change the team. We played as well as we could under the conditions. Obviously if we had Cleary, DCE, Reynolds etc we would have taken more opportunities. But we don’t have them. We have an older halfback that has barely played halfback. Sexton might be better but he would change team cohesion. And that could make us even worse. 

I was extremely dissapointed with the result as the game was ours to win and we couldn't close it out. Too many players tried to do too much themselves and brought on our own demise. What was evident was Hutchison should not be our half he is too slow and doesn't read the game too well, Taaffe is not a FB and would make a better half, Connor Tracey to FB, Ciraldo to learn how to rotate the bench better, souffs are still the grubbiest team in the NRL and Sutton is still a cheating p.o.s. Had the Dogs played the game much smarter they could have overcome the dodgy decisions against them.... and won easily.

If the pro foul and hit on JAC were perpetrated by us we'd have started the 2nd half with 11 on the field... 

We did win the penalty count. Although I agree Sutton should have put at least one South’s player in the bin. Numerous professional fouls. Hip drop. Dangerous contact etc. 

But we should have scored more points with the possession we had. 

Most blatant was a professional foul hold down after a line break by us close to halftime, the ref even gave a penalty. I've never seen that not result in a trip to the bin.

The hip drop was also dubious and is also usually a penalty.

I am not sure if Sutton is biased against us now or just a crap ref, he gets whistle happy at times and seems to be wearing a blindfold at other times.

Yes Micko, we did win the penalty count but quality far outweighs quantity. It is where and when they were given is what counts and it didn't count much for us. I was at the game yesterday and we did have enough possession to win that game, unfortunately some players think there is an "I" in team. Way too much one out garbage. We had souffs on the rack and we stupidly let them off the hook with dumb plays, but I have to mention that Sutton did his "fair share" of easing the pressure off them.

I am also happy to see no changes for a week or two or whatever Cirro decides.

After the previous game I was ready to  drop Taaffe and I thought Hutch and Mann were two of our better players. This week I have completely flipped my ratings.

So I think give these players long enough prove if they have it and give the possible next lot plenty of time to prepare. I don't want to see yo-yo selections with guys being dropped and back up two games later.

So far I am inclined to agree with Cirro we lost the game due to execution. The first two Souths tries were fairly soft and bad misses by our recent standards. Even that third try we needed more scramble at the start.

Foxy being injured wasn't ideal, but the Morrin drop in a try scoring position after doing most of the hard work was a turning point.

There are too many times to mention when better execution and decision making from us would have resulted in points.

It isn't like the team don't have it in them, they just couldn't get it done.

What will it take? It will be a lot easier when we get it done once, Players need to trust the game plan, stick to their role, play to their strengths and execute. And players just need a bit more intent, run harder, stand deeper, move the ball faster.

We can't get it done, until we can. Chooks are real contenders and when they get it together very few teams can go with them. So a win against them would be a definite statement, last season we would have waved the white flag before kick-off. What I want to see is intent, us trying to win the game, not just making up the numbers.

Win or lose players who stand out in a game like this are quality.

When deciding to make team changes all performances this season need to be considered.

Anyone we consider for halfback or fullback needs to have played that role in the  NRL or reserve grade recently.

Rather than actual spine changes I would consider the mix between attack and defence. We need to drop a defensive player and promote an attacking player. Salmon is the guy I would drop based on all games this season.

And I would consider trying BBO, Xerri or Skeleton on the bench, what I am after is more leg speed. As soon as we have good cover for Foxy on the bench I bet he finishes every game.

What I hate more than anything this season is Salmon moving to the centres after Foxy was injured.  I can’t believe we did it twice it doesn't work in attack or defence.

....and to 95% of players....

I think Salmon is needed more than almost anybody else in the team. He is playing that first receiver option well and his defence is very strong. Moving him to the centres was the only real option after the injury. No other player could have done that job as well. Curran, Mann are not centres. And we can’t play a prop there. 

Is there any good halfback available??? Any chance of a mid season buy??? We desperately need somebody

TTAAFFEE gets another chance at FB easily or mine... if D is our main concern dropping Hutch then I'd rather have to protect 7exy at 7 than TTAAFFEE at 7... 

7exy is a must... 
Curran starts at 13
Manncrush 14
The farmer back to 8...
Knight to the bench...
The Fish out...

Traci guns is for mine no better a FB than TTAAFFEE and definitely not better a 7 than 7exy.... But he may be a better 7 than Hutch... 

At full strength Wilson is the ideal player for the role I described. At the end of a game with tired players speed and footwork only needs a small gap.

Salmon works hard in defence, but his passing and running are zero threat. It is a shame Hutch has no pace because he often gets into great positions.

I think if we start Curran, Morrin first interchange follfollowed by Mann, then Hughes that is the best rotation.

IMO Curran, Morrin and Mann are way more dangerous in attack than Salmon, we may get more value if we inject our attacking threats earlier.

If Cirro wants to keep the same rotation I would promote Harrison Edwards in place of Salmon. I am surprised Edwards hasn't played more NRL.

If we don't want a small back on the bench then a guy like KK, he was impressive in the trials.or keep Salmon on the bench as a second rower / lock.

Sexton was pretty good in the trails and must be close to getting a chance.

IMO Hutch is executing a mostly good kicking game and a mostly good passing game. Him and Mann are doing a lot of good work in attack but are also running too often and are not doing a good job or organising the side.

That is the other reason why I want to deal Salmon out, Mahoney, Mann and Hutch need to form a combination and show that they can organise the side. For that to work Mann needs more time on the field in that role. Going by the Souths game this combination isn't going to work, but individually all players have the skills.

We also need to decide who is calling the play. If Burto doesn't call Hutch needs to call it and the outcome is on him. All that is needed is for Hutch to communicate what the option will be. It can be a forward running off Mann if that is called.

Similarly if Sexton gets a shot we need his kicking game to at least match Hutch and then he needs to organise the attack. If his running game is better we can allow him a few missed tackles. 

If Salmon stays in the side he needs to get good a hole running and develop some footwork. And he needs to learn when and how to run a decoy, he crucified what would have been an easy try to Kiks.

If begs the question why we didn't get the ball to Kiks with time and space and Kiraz outside him more often.  Critter knows how to time the decoys anyone else should just stay a support runner.
.

The first penalty to Souths off the Latrell kick was a real momentum changer Mahoney barely touched him.

But he also never got a penalty one all of the occasions when the markers were not square. Playing at home for Parra Marhoney got those penalties everytime.

I still think we are making progress and are not far off. 

Execution and attention to detail are what is needed, don't risk giving a dumb penalty.

The dumbest penalty was Tracey who handed Latrell a kick in front to go to 20-12. Burton the needed to rush the conversion without a kicking tee. If we were only trailing by 6 Burton would have had a kick to take the game to Golden Point. 

Golden Point would have been a fairly accurate indication of the 80 mins, only  because of the mistakes we made to keep Souths in the game. 

Make them watch the video 10 times :)

I don't remember seeing much of Taaffe playing 7, he is only just starting to show promise at 1.

When in doubt get the ball to Kiks on the left or Taaffe on the right.

Close to the opponent's try line off a quick PTB or a single marker just run from dummy-half,or dummy-half plays to a hard running forward.

Murray showed the kind of pass a lock should be throwing if he isn't going out the back.

I am on the fence on Sexy because I haven't seen him play much this season and he was mixed last season.  However, Hutch is starting to run out of chances, he needs to show a lot more organisational ability.

7exys kicking game is far superior to Hutchs... And Hutch ain't organising sh1t...

Hutch has kicked pretty well the last couple of weeks. 

I can't remember how Sexty kicked last season. 

I don't know why Cirro initially preferred Hutch apparently it was a close call. 

I think we are over compensating for last season so Cirro is favouring good defenders.

I don’t think the poor performance against Souths was all on one guy.  Marhoney and Mann stuffed a lot of things up and wasted a lot of time before Hutch got the ball...

But when we get slow ball to Hutch in space him running is a bad option, that is the sort of thing we need to sort out.

Some players out of the Chooks clash.
Foxy - concussion- 1-2 weeks.
Morrin- suspended- 2 weeks.
Preston- fractured jaw - 3-4 weeks.
We are forced to make changes and cover Preston longer term. 
Wilson for Foxy is the easy change.
IMO Farmer starting and Knight back to the bench.
I would move Salmon to right edge backrower and start Curran.
If we are going to gamble on Sexton, Salmon will help him, we don't want Sexton teamed up with a rookie backrower.
We need to find one more high workrate player for the bench who can also cover backrow, if KK is available he would be first choice followed by Edwards.
The left field suggestion would be Xerri gambling on him or Kiraz filling in in the forwards if necessary.

Bloody terrible news re Presto...
The Fish to edge makes sense... It makes even more sense if long term plan is Curran to 13... 
I do not like these left wing ideas of playing guys like Kiraz out of position... He's way too valuable at centre or wing...

Fair point, the problem I have is the lack of cover in the outside backs or spine with injury/HIA.

We where pretty unlucky both times Fox got injured and it definitely cost us. There are 4 spine players + 4 outside backs who can potentially get injuries/HIA and 5 forwards on the field + at least 3 on the bench. Forwards are more likely to get involved in big collisions.

Making it even trickier for us, Farmer, Hughes and Knight can't play big minutes.

We have a good young player Samarini who looks like an ideal guy to cover backrow and centre off the bench, but he is a bit too young / inexperienced to pick at this stage. 

Lachlan Vale racked up 45 tackles playing second row in reserve grade, don't know much about him.

Against the Chooks we definitely need Farmer, Knight and Hughes, but we also need fit high workrate players to cancel that out.

Our forwards don't have the minutes to carry a specialist back on the bench, injury / HIA is then a big risk. Next time we will need to try Mann in the centres, that may work better than Salmon...

While I don't rate Salmon's running or passing in the middle or centre, I think it might work out in the backrow. If he is hitting a hole he doesn't  necessarily need footwork and he runs hard enough. Passing to his centre partner or dropping the centre under suits his passing.  Even a pass to the winger is within his range.

If we keep him at lock we might play Curran on the edge. I would not do that but Cirro might.

If we keep the same side, I would definitely cut down the number of plays where the lock plays first receiver, and/or stand Hutch deeper and move the ball faster.

Marhoney needs to straighten up his game especially in the middle of the field at the opponent's end.

The lock and hooker slowly running across field with a shallow attacking formation gave the opponent's plenty of time to get their line set and move up. Worse still our players tend to get confused as to when to time their runs and often got the ball standing still.

I am sure that the coaches can devise a training drill to sort this out, one that involves a timer and sit ups for punishment. If I was playing that would get me passing fast and running hard, I hate situps.

Mann should have gone to centre both times...

I tend to agree with this.
Mann does alot of jinking (sometimes too much).
He wouldn't look out of sorts in the centres and probably should have the first optiom to play there while we had injuries and HIAs.

He needs to cut oit some of that jinking coz at times he looks like he jinks back towards the player he just beat.