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Muz
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? As others have stated, they have gone completely Brazilian in their methodology and NC. They and are about 15- 20 years down the pathway of their 50 year plan. They have invested big bucks in their system too. About 5 years ago Arsene Wenger anointed Japan as having a world class development system . In Aus there is no money for football development, and football development runs on an oily rag. I'm not sure who you are watching ATM? The younger Aussie players, 21 and under, coming through are very good technically. They are products of the new Aus development system, having been inculcated it for 10 years or so. I'd also anoint the entire Japanese football system overall, only outside the Big Seven leagues in world football. Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal may possibly be marginally in front of Japan too. Japan could even be in front of Switzerland, Croatia and Mexico. Thjey DONT have a NC Decentric... Their coaching system relies, at least at the base, quite heavily on volunteers and high schools and also runs quite frugaly. There are more than one way to skin a cat however Football Australia, seems to not even know what a cat looks like. I understand your "anointing" hither and tither, it is hard to be objective about something when you have been indoctrinated in the "system" and we can all be guilty of assuming our interpretation of issues is the correct one however Arsene Wenger, Hans Berger and Graham Arnold are not the football geniuses you want them to be. Here are some of the progenitors of the football methodology the NC is based on - Rinus Michels, Michael Platini, Victor Maslov, Valery Lobanovski, Tito Vilanova, Johann Cruyff, Louis Van Gaal. Which 'football geniuses' do you think Australia needs to improve us further, that I haven't mentioned? Football Aus have discarded the ideas of Angel Herrerra, Charles Reep and Charles Hughes. The former's concepts have been discarded because they don't the suit the Aussie psyche or mentality. The latter two, because their ideas have not extrapolated to success in international football over a sustained period. Has it ever been defined 1. what the Aussie pysche or mentality actually is, and 2. how unique it is? Dutch and Aussie leading coaches, TDs, etc, consider the Aus mentality in sport generally, and football in particular, is wanting to dominate games and be proactive. Conversely, the Italian style, influenced by Herrerra's lighting bolt/ catenaccio style, reactive football, thought to not being suitable for Aussie players because of the Aus deemed mentality. At the same time the Football AusTechnical Dept, the KNVB, and Clarefontaine, consider Italy has had sustained success playing reactive football based on opponents' mistakes. However, no other team has has the same sort of sustained international success doing what Italy have done so well. The Aus mentality being deemed similar to France, Netherlands, Germany, who like to dominate games. Psuedo psychology babblespeak. 'Like to dominate games'? So from this we can assert that other countries enjoy being dominated? What is this? Football S&M? The amount of nonsense that has been spouted about Australian athletes without a shred off evidence... New to the forum are you? Hahahahaha this 'babblespeak' is par for the course. It's all about milieu dear boy, the milieu.
Member since 2008.
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Muz
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? They went Brazillian decades ago. There is also the cultural difference in terms of what type of player is seen as fitting their football culture that will also be the type that gets picked by youth coaches to progress up the junior ranks. I'm convinced our failures to produce technical players at the senior is more due to the coaches who choose physicality over footballing ability-that's our "culture". Sort of my point though. https://www.sbs.com.au/sport/article/asia-youth-development-japan-lead-the-way/3yawy7my1Main points for me: Whilst they do have a JFA "academy" that is pay to play most players are "developed" through J league and other club academies that are very price accessible No national "one size fits all" curriculumNational school tournaments are very big deal and some finals can get 50 thousand fans Both Germany and Belgium recently had a one size fits all curriculum. Germany's program yielded 3rd place in 2010 and Champions in 2014. Belgium's program didn't achieve the same results in tournaments, but it did produce some of the best footballers in the world of this generation. And now? I missed this . I don’t know what they’re doing now, but both Germany and Belgium used similarly centralised national development concept like we did at the same time we did, Do there’s nothing wrong with that approach per se. Obviously their outcomes were much better at producing highly technical footballers than we were.
I believe it’s due the implementation rather than the concept of everyone singing from the same hymn book They have the pick of the best athletes. We don't. Not really, they have other sports to compete with as well, they are just way better at identifying footballers at a young age and knowing what should be done to develop them into world class players.... It helps they have hundreds of professional clubs to help them do this as opposed to 11. Not only that. Divide our population by 4 and we still have more people than Croatia and Uruguay to pick just 2.
Member since 2008.
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Decentric 2
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 3.1K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? They went Brazillian decades ago. There is also the cultural difference in terms of what type of player is seen as fitting their football culture that will also be the type that gets picked by youth coaches to progress up the junior ranks. I'm convinced our failures to produce technical players at the senior is more due to the coaches who choose physicality over footballing ability-that's our "culture". Sort of my point though. https://www.sbs.com.au/sport/article/asia-youth-development-japan-lead-the-way/3yawy7my1Main points for me: Whilst they do have a JFA "academy" that is pay to play most players are "developed" through J league and other club academies that are very price accessible No national "one size fits all" curriculumNational school tournaments are very big deal and some finals can get 50 thousand fans Both Germany and Belgium recently had a one size fits all curriculum. Germany's program yielded 3rd place in 2010 and Champions in 2014. Belgium's program didn't achieve the same results in tournaments, but it did produce some of the best footballers in the world of this generation. And now? I missed this . I don’t know what they’re doing now, but both Germany and Belgium used similarly centralised national development concept like we did at the same time we did, Do there’s nothing wrong with that approach per se. Obviously their outcomes were much better at producing highly technical footballers than we were.
I believe it’s due the implementation rather than the concept of everyone singing from the same hymn book They have the pick of the best athletes. We don't. True.
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Decentric 2
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 3.1K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? As others have stated, they have gone completely Brazilian in their methodology and NC. They and are about 15- 20 years down the pathway of their 50 year plan. They have invested big bucks in their system too. About 5 years ago Arsene Wenger anointed Japan as having a world class development system . In Aus there is no money for football development, and football development runs on an oily rag. I'm not sure who you are watching ATM? The younger Aussie players, 21 and under, coming through are very good technically. They are products of the new Aus development system, having been inculcated it for 10 years or so. I'd also anoint the entire Japanese football system overall, only outside the Big Seven leagues in world football. Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal may possibly be marginally in front of Japan too. Japan could even be in front of Switzerland, Croatia and Mexico. Thjey DONT have a NC Decentric... Their coaching system relies, at least at the base, quite heavily on volunteers and high schools and also runs quite frugaly. There are more than one way to skin a cat however Football Australia, seems to not even know what a cat looks like. I understand your "anointing" hither and tither, it is hard to be objective about something when you have been indoctrinated in the "system" and we can all be guilty of assuming our interpretation of issues is the correct one however Arsene Wenger, Hans Berger and Graham Arnold are not the football geniuses you want them to be. Here are some of the progenitors of the football methodology the NC is based on - Rinus Michels, Michael Platini, Victor Maslov, Valery Lobanovski, Tito Vilanova, Johann Cruyff, Louis Van Gaal. Which 'football geniuses' do you think Australia needs to improve us further, that I haven't mentioned? Football Aus have discarded the ideas of Angel Herrerra, Charles Reep and Charles Hughes. The former's concepts have been discarded because they don't the suit the Aussie psyche or mentality. The latter two, because their ideas have not extrapolated to success in international football over a sustained period. Has it ever been defined 1. what the Aussie pysche or mentality actually is, and 2. how unique it is? Dutch and Aussie leading coaches, TDs, etc, consider the Aus mentality in sport generally, and football in particular, is wanting to dominate games and be proactive. Conversely, the Italian style, influenced by Herrerra's lighting bolt/ catenaccio style, reactive football, thought to not being suitable for Aussie players because of the Aus deemed mentality. At the same time the Football AusTechnical Dept, the KNVB, and Clarefontaine, consider Italy has had sustained success playing reactive football based on opponents' mistakes. However, no other team has has the same sort of sustained international success doing what Italy have done so well. The Aus mentality being deemed similar to France, Netherlands, Germany, who like to dominate games. Psuedo psychology babblespeak. 'Like to dominate games'? So from this we can assert that other countries enjoy being dominated? What is this? Football S&M? The amount of nonsense that has been spouted about Australian athletes without a shred off evidence... With due respect, these findings have been arrived at by the then FFA Tech Dept - Han Berger, Rob Baan, Kelly Cross, Jan Versleijen, Alistair Edwards, et al. They also believe that the Italian psyche, is they like to draw other teams in and spring traps as the masters of Reactive football. That Italians are keener to not have the ball, like to track runners, and launch counter attacks, than other world football powerhouses.
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Decentric 2
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+xThe main purpose of the coaching regime from 2007 onwards was to improve the poor technical skills of the players . So far it’s failed.
Why?
is it the program itself? I doubt it.
Is it the implementation? Most likely.
Go and watch the highlights of the India game. Listen to Simons comments about the poor touch and ball control.
Nothings changed. It has changed - radically. Bos is the first Socceroo from the new Berger/Baan conceived system. The players of his cohort are the first who've started with the Skills Acquisition Program about 10 years ago. Bos is one player all have seen play who are reading this post. Do a technical appraisal of Bos, Enzo, and anybody else reading this, who thinks Bos is rubbish as a technician? Use the Football Aus check list ( based on France, Spain, Netherlands and Germany) of - first touch, striking the ball, running with the ball, handling speed, both sides of the body use, two footedness, plus 1v1 attacking and defensive skills - and appraise Bos. He is the first Socceroo of the new system. Haven't had much access to the AL for a few years since Fox abandoned it. But have just subscribed to Paramount. We have the most technically adept generation, we've ever had for age 21 and under in Aus. Arnie enunciated he had never seen Aussie players do the things Bos and his cohorts were doing in an Aus Under 16, Under 17 national team a few years back. Arnie is disappointed a few of Bos's cohort have left football. From what I've seen of Bos, Hollman, Farrell, Circati, Kuol, Irankunda, possibly Talbot, Milanovic, and Robertson ( haven't seen enough of them yet) - using Football Aus's technical skills check list, and adding a few more refinements, these guys are the best technicians Aus has ever had. There are a lot I haven't seen yet. Arnie is on the record, and reiterates, this view of a whizz kid technical generation emerging - with the oldest being 21 years old. Bos could simply be the exceptional talent rather than the rule. Until I see a squad of players with technical ability like Bos, I'll hold the champagne. I watched Irankunda close up for the first time at the game on Sat night between SFC & Adelaide, this guy has raw speed & power, he has spacial awareness & technically sound, I had keep reminding myself he is only 17 years old, not surprised Bayern Munich came for him. Likewise with another young Adelaide player in Johnny Yull, very technically sound, Chelsea came for last year but was knocked back. Likewise I thought with Gridwood-Reich & Hollman (his brother even better for MacArthur) for SFC, all very technically sound. I'm also replying to Enzo's previous post. At the time of viewing it, I hadn't had access to watching a lot of Aus players aged 22 and under. Enzo stated he accepted that Bos has considerable technical talent, but was't sure about his cohorts. I've watched quite a few young AL players and 5 complete matches of the Under 23s - where they haven't been defeated in 90 mins of football against Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Egypt, South Korea and Iraq. Australia never had a full strength squad. Vidmar must have played about 30 odd players, to evaluate what they could do under similar match conditions and to trial even younger players than 21-22. Others tell me that the opposition nearly always had full strength squads. In this case the performance and results indicate there has been a technical improvement in the younger players having had 8-11 years of the new Dutch/French/Spanish style NC. I identified improvement as particularly apparent in two footedness, use of both sides of body use, first touch, handling speed, ball carrying and 1v1 attacking skills. One issue that is still apparent is too many Aus players still tackle with their preferred foot, rather than use both sides of the body to tackle. This can result in body shape that isn't optimal when tackling. Australia was more tactically sound than all oppenents which enhanced performances. Probably only Egypt and Saudi Arabia were marginally better technicians than the Aus U 23s who turned out. Girdwood-Reich I hadn't thought was as technically sound as Circati or Natta as CBs, based on Aus U 23 performances or senior Socceroos. Haven't seen Johny Yull - yet. Look forward to it. Corey Hollman is a superb all round player, and a decent technician. Ditto Nieuwenhof. The players that are really impressing me with their technique on the ball are the even younger Voladan ( only a Melb Vic bench player at senior level), Youlley and Segecic. The first two in particular need to do a lot of work in their game off the ball, but when they have the ball at their feet, they are of class we've struggled to produce. From what I'm seeing, if few of these players make the Big Five UEFA leagues, there are also about other 40 Big Clubs in UEFA, who consistently play intra-continental UEFA football, a greater percentage of our footballers are going to be playing in these leagues or the 40 Big Clubs like Ajax, Sporting Lisbon, Standard Liege, Grasshoppers, PAOK, etc. If they don't get there, they will be more likely to play in other clubs in Netherlands, Belgium, Switzerland, etc, who play club games against them. Many of the 40 Big Clubs would be better than the mid and lower rankled teams in the Big Five leagues. I'd surmise PSV Eindhoven, Ajax, Anderlecht, Porto, Benfica, Sporting, Shakta Donesk ( prior to the war) would beat the lower ranked teams in the Big Five leagues. ATM Grazor posted some sort of coefficient that Aus should have about 10 Big Five players according to our national performances. A lot of the punching above weight appears to be due to sound tactics and being a savvy international team unit.
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robbos
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+xThe main purpose of the coaching regime from 2007 onwards was to improve the poor technical skills of the players . So far it’s failed.
Why?
is it the program itself? I doubt it.
Is it the implementation? Most likely.
Go and watch the highlights of the India game. Listen to Simons comments about the poor touch and ball control.
Nothings changed. It has changed - radically. Bos is the first Socceroo from the new Berger/Baan conceived system. The players of his cohort are the first who've started with the Skills Acquisition Program about 10 years ago. Bos is one player all have seen play who are reading this post. Do a technical appraisal of Bos, Enzo, and anybody else reading this, who thinks Bos is rubbish as a technician? Use the Football Aus check list ( based on France, Spain, Netherlands and Germany) of - first touch, striking the ball, running with the ball, handling speed, both sides of the body use, two footedness, plus 1v1 attacking and defensive skills - and appraise Bos. He is the first Socceroo of the new system. Haven't had much access to the AL for a few years since Fox abandoned it. But have just subscribed to Paramount. We have the most technically adept generation, we've ever had for age 21 and under in Aus. Arnie enunciated he had never seen Aussie players do the things Bos and his cohorts were doing in an Aus Under 16, Under 17 national team a few years back. Arnie is disappointed a few of Bos's cohort have left football. From what I've seen of Bos, Hollman, Farrell, Circati, Kuol, Irankunda, possibly Talbot, Milanovic, and Robertson ( haven't seen enough of them yet) - using Football Aus's technical skills check list, and adding a few more refinements, these guys are the best technicians Aus has ever had. There are a lot I haven't seen yet. Arnie is on the record, and reiterates, this view of a whizz kid technical generation emerging - with the oldest being 21 years old. Bos could simply be the exceptional talent rather than the rule. Until I see a squad of players with technical ability like Bos, I'll hold the champagne. I watched Irankunda close up for the first time at the game on Sat night between SFC & Adelaide, this guy has raw speed & power, he has spacial awareness & technically sound, I had keep reminding myself he is only 17 years old, not surprised Bayern Munich came for him. Likewise with another young Adelaide player in Johnny Yull, very technically sound, Chelsea came for last year but was knocked back. Likewise I thought with Gridwood-Reich & Hollman (his brother even better for MacArthur) for SFC, all very technically sound.
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Monoethnic Social Club
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? They went Brazillian decades ago. There is also the cultural difference in terms of what type of player is seen as fitting their football culture that will also be the type that gets picked by youth coaches to progress up the junior ranks. I'm convinced our failures to produce technical players at the senior is more due to the coaches who choose physicality over footballing ability-that's our "culture". Sort of my point though. https://www.sbs.com.au/sport/article/asia-youth-development-japan-lead-the-way/3yawy7my1Main points for me: Whilst they do have a JFA "academy" that is pay to play most players are "developed" through J league and other club academies that are very price accessible No national "one size fits all" curriculumNational school tournaments are very big deal and some finals can get 50 thousand fans Both Germany and Belgium recently had a one size fits all curriculum. Germany's program yielded 3rd place in 2010 and Champions in 2014. Belgium's program didn't achieve the same results in tournaments, but it did produce some of the best footballers in the world of this generation. And now? I missed this . I don’t know what they’re doing now, but both Germany and Belgium used similarly centralised national development concept like we did at the same time we did, Do there’s nothing wrong with that approach per se. Obviously their outcomes were much better at producing highly technical footballers than we were.
I believe it’s due the implementation rather than the concept of everyone singing from the same hymn book They have the pick of the best athletes. We don't. Not really, they have other sports to compete with as well, they are just way better at identifying footballers at a young age and knowing what should be done to develop them into world class players.... It helps they have hundreds of professional clubs to help them do this as opposed to 11.
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charlied
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? They went Brazillian decades ago. There is also the cultural difference in terms of what type of player is seen as fitting their football culture that will also be the type that gets picked by youth coaches to progress up the junior ranks. I'm convinced our failures to produce technical players at the senior is more due to the coaches who choose physicality over footballing ability-that's our "culture". Sort of my point though. https://www.sbs.com.au/sport/article/asia-youth-development-japan-lead-the-way/3yawy7my1Main points for me: Whilst they do have a JFA "academy" that is pay to play most players are "developed" through J league and other club academies that are very price accessible No national "one size fits all" curriculumNational school tournaments are very big deal and some finals can get 50 thousand fans Both Germany and Belgium recently had a one size fits all curriculum. Germany's program yielded 3rd place in 2010 and Champions in 2014. Belgium's program didn't achieve the same results in tournaments, but it did produce some of the best footballers in the world of this generation. And now? I missed this . I don’t know what they’re doing now, but both Germany and Belgium used similarly centralised national development concept like we did at the same time we did, Do there’s nothing wrong with that approach per se. Obviously their outcomes were much better at producing highly technical footballers than we were.
I believe it’s due the implementation rather than the concept of everyone singing from the same hymn book They have the pick of the best athletes. We don't.
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Monoethnic Social Club
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? They went Brazillian decades ago. There is also the cultural difference in terms of what type of player is seen as fitting their football culture that will also be the type that gets picked by youth coaches to progress up the junior ranks. I'm convinced our failures to produce technical players at the senior is more due to the coaches who choose physicality over footballing ability-that's our "culture". Sort of my point though. https://www.sbs.com.au/sport/article/asia-youth-development-japan-lead-the-way/3yawy7my1Main points for me: Whilst they do have a JFA "academy" that is pay to play most players are "developed" through J league and other club academies that are very price accessible No national "one size fits all" curriculumNational school tournaments are very big deal and some finals can get 50 thousand fans Both Germany and Belgium recently had a one size fits all curriculum. Germany's program yielded 3rd place in 2010 and Champions in 2014. Belgium's program didn't achieve the same results in tournaments, but it did produce some of the best footballers in the world of this generation. And now? I missed this . I don’t know what they’re doing now, but both Germany and Belgium used similarly centralised national development concept like we did at the same time we did, Do there’s nothing wrong with that approach per se.Obviously their outcomes were much better at producing highly technical footballers than we were.
I believe it’s due the implementation rather than the concept of everyone singing from the same hymn book No, there is nothing wrong with the approach I agree, but whats is frustrating is not acknowledging that results show that method needs to be reviewed every now and again no?
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? They went Brazillian decades ago. There is also the cultural difference in terms of what type of player is seen as fitting their football culture that will also be the type that gets picked by youth coaches to progress up the junior ranks. I'm convinced our failures to produce technical players at the senior is more due to the coaches who choose physicality over footballing ability-that's our "culture". Sort of my point though. https://www.sbs.com.au/sport/article/asia-youth-development-japan-lead-the-way/3yawy7my1Main points for me: Whilst they do have a JFA "academy" that is pay to play most players are "developed" through J league and other club academies that are very price accessible No national "one size fits all" curriculumNational school tournaments are very big deal and some finals can get 50 thousand fans Both Germany and Belgium recently had a one size fits all curriculum. Germany's program yielded 3rd place in 2010 and Champions in 2014. Belgium's program didn't achieve the same results in tournaments, but it did produce some of the best footballers in the world of this generation. And now? I missed this . I don’t know what they’re doing now, but both Germany and Belgium used similarly centralised national development concept like we did at the same time we did, Do there’s nothing wrong with that approach per se. Obviously their outcomes were much better at producing highly technical footballers than we were.
I believe it’s due the implementation rather than the concept of everyone singing from the same hymn book
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? As others have stated, they have gone completely Brazilian in their methodology and NC. They and are about 15- 20 years down the pathway of their 50 year plan. They have invested big bucks in their system too. About 5 years ago Arsene Wenger anointed Japan as having a world class development system . In Aus there is no money for football development, and football development runs on an oily rag. I'm not sure who you are watching ATM? The younger Aussie players, 21 and under, coming through are very good technically. They are products of the new Aus development system, having been inculcated it for 10 years or so. I'd also anoint the entire Japanese football system overall, only outside the Big Seven leagues in world football. Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal may possibly be marginally in front of Japan too. Japan could even be in front of Switzerland, Croatia and Mexico. Thjey DONT have a NC Decentric... Their coaching system relies, at least at the base, quite heavily on volunteers and high schools and also runs quite frugaly. There are more than one way to skin a cat however Football Australia, seems to not even know what a cat looks like. I understand your "anointing" hither and tither, it is hard to be objective about something when you have been indoctrinated in the "system" and we can all be guilty of assuming our interpretation of issues is the correct one however Arsene Wenger, Hans Berger and Graham Arnold are not the football geniuses you want them to be. What you don't seem to be aware of , MOE, is that a lot of rationale that I present for an Aus NC, is based on football boffins from Football Aus. It is not my personal opinion, although I've been influenced by persuasive arguments. I defer to football experts. Plus the Tech Depts of KNVB, Clarefontaine, German Football Fed and Spanish Football Fed, particularly Barca Academy, are the sources for our current football direction in Aus. They've addressed Aussie audiences, held workshops and coach education sessions/courses that I've attended in Aus. National systems have been deemed to work effectively in those powerhouse football nations over a sustained period. You exude a smugness that these practices are not suitable for Aus - or not working. If you want to disagree with the rationale and practice in those nations, and us following suit, it is your prerogative. Do you think we should adopt the Greek Football Fed's methodology in Aus instead of the four big powerhouses in Europe? Football Aus have had staff coaches visit Uruguay, Brazil, Argentina, and even Japan, to evaluate sound football methodological practices that can be extrapolated to Australia. Incorrect Decentric, I (and everyone else I assume) am very aware that you sing from the same old tired FFA hymn book. I just dont agree with the message nor the application. As for your barely disguised bigotry about "Greek football" methodology supposedly being championed by me because I am an Australian of Greek ancestry well, I guess that's your prerogative. A sad reflection on what "multiculturalism" really means in Australia in 2024... Thanks for the reminder. Geez you love playing the man not the ball dont you... Mate, not really... Im talking about Japan not having a bullshit national rulebook and relying on building clubs to better their football and old mate plays the "better than Greeks" card..... seriously? Everyone is entitled to their own opinion whether you agree with it or not, being divisive isnt the way to go about it. Fair enough point taken, Ill just have to put up with the slings and arrows then. MOE - have never posted before but read with interest most posts!! Talk about singing from the same hymn book!!! It's good to know that EVERYONE except you is racist!!!! Thanks for your comment johnjade. Not entirely sure which race or ethnicity you feel I discriminate against but would be willing to read your thoughts... or do you need to log out and log back in again?
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charlied
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 2.4K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? As others have stated, they have gone completely Brazilian in their methodology and NC. They and are about 15- 20 years down the pathway of their 50 year plan. They have invested big bucks in their system too. About 5 years ago Arsene Wenger anointed Japan as having a world class development system . In Aus there is no money for football development, and football development runs on an oily rag. I'm not sure who you are watching ATM? The younger Aussie players, 21 and under, coming through are very good technically. They are products of the new Aus development system, having been inculcated it for 10 years or so. I'd also anoint the entire Japanese football system overall, only outside the Big Seven leagues in world football. Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal may possibly be marginally in front of Japan too. Japan could even be in front of Switzerland, Croatia and Mexico. Thjey DONT have a NC Decentric... Their coaching system relies, at least at the base, quite heavily on volunteers and high schools and also runs quite frugaly. There are more than one way to skin a cat however Football Australia, seems to not even know what a cat looks like. I understand your "anointing" hither and tither, it is hard to be objective about something when you have been indoctrinated in the "system" and we can all be guilty of assuming our interpretation of issues is the correct one however Arsene Wenger, Hans Berger and Graham Arnold are not the football geniuses you want them to be. Here are some of the progenitors of the football methodology the NC is based on - Rinus Michels, Michael Platini, Victor Maslov, Valery Lobanovski, Tito Vilanova, Johann Cruyff, Louis Van Gaal. Which 'football geniuses' do you think Australia needs to improve us further, that I haven't mentioned? Football Aus have discarded the ideas of Angel Herrerra, Charles Reep and Charles Hughes. The former's concepts have been discarded because they don't the suit the Aussie psyche or mentality. The latter two, because their ideas have not extrapolated to success in international football over a sustained period. Has it ever been defined 1. what the Aussie pysche or mentality actually is, and 2. how unique it is? Dutch and Aussie leading coaches, TDs, etc, consider the Aus mentality in sport generally, and football in particular, is wanting to dominate games and be proactive. Conversely, the Italian style, influenced by Herrerra's lighting bolt/ catenaccio style, reactive football, thought to not being suitable for Aussie players because of the Aus deemed mentality. At the same time the Football AusTechnical Dept, the KNVB, and Clarefontaine, consider Italy has had sustained success playing reactive football based on opponents' mistakes. However, no other team has has the same sort of sustained international success doing what Italy have done so well. The Aus mentality being deemed similar to France, Netherlands, Germany, who like to dominate games. Psuedo psychology babblespeak. 'Like to dominate games'? So from this we can assert that other countries enjoy being dominated? What is this? Football S&M? The amount of nonsense that has been spouted about Australian athletes without a shred off evidence...
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localstar
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 2.1K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? As others have stated, they have gone completely Brazilian in their methodology and NC. They and are about 15- 20 years down the pathway of their 50 year plan. They have invested big bucks in their system too. About 5 years ago Arsene Wenger anointed Japan as having a world class development system . In Aus there is no money for football development, and football development runs on an oily rag. I'm not sure who you are watching ATM? The younger Aussie players, 21 and under, coming through are very good technically. They are products of the new Aus development system, having been inculcated it for 10 years or so. I'd also anoint the entire Japanese football system overall, only outside the Big Seven leagues in world football. Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal may possibly be marginally in front of Japan too. Japan could even be in front of Switzerland, Croatia and Mexico. Thjey DONT have a NC Decentric... Their coaching system relies, at least at the base, quite heavily on volunteers and high schools and also runs quite frugaly. There are more than one way to skin a cat however Football Australia, seems to not even know what a cat looks like. I understand your "anointing" hither and tither, it is hard to be objective about something when you have been indoctrinated in the "system" and we can all be guilty of assuming our interpretation of issues is the correct one however Arsene Wenger, Hans Berger and Graham Arnold are not the football geniuses you want them to be. Here are some of the progenitors of the football methodology the NC is based on - Rinus Michels, Michael Platini, Victor Maslov, Valery Lobanovski, Tito Vilanova, Johann Cruyff, Louis Van Gaal. Which 'football geniuses' do you think Australia needs to improve us further, that I haven't mentioned? Football Aus have discarded the ideas of Angel Herrerra, Charles Reep and Charles Hughes. The former's concepts have been discarded because they don't the suit the Aussie psyche or mentality. The latter two, because their ideas have not extrapolated to success in international football over a sustained period. Don't think "Football Australia" have ever been influenced by the ideas of Reep and Hughes. "Football Australia" didn't exist in the 1950s.Your beloved national curriculum didn't exist back then. You will pull any old rabbit out of the hat to support your agenda.
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johnjade
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 2,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? As others have stated, they have gone completely Brazilian in their methodology and NC. They and are about 15- 20 years down the pathway of their 50 year plan. They have invested big bucks in their system too. About 5 years ago Arsene Wenger anointed Japan as having a world class development system . In Aus there is no money for football development, and football development runs on an oily rag. I'm not sure who you are watching ATM? The younger Aussie players, 21 and under, coming through are very good technically. They are products of the new Aus development system, having been inculcated it for 10 years or so. I'd also anoint the entire Japanese football system overall, only outside the Big Seven leagues in world football. Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal may possibly be marginally in front of Japan too. Japan could even be in front of Switzerland, Croatia and Mexico. Thjey DONT have a NC Decentric... Their coaching system relies, at least at the base, quite heavily on volunteers and high schools and also runs quite frugaly. There are more than one way to skin a cat however Football Australia, seems to not even know what a cat looks like. I understand your "anointing" hither and tither, it is hard to be objective about something when you have been indoctrinated in the "system" and we can all be guilty of assuming our interpretation of issues is the correct one however Arsene Wenger, Hans Berger and Graham Arnold are not the football geniuses you want them to be. What you don't seem to be aware of , MOE, is that a lot of rationale that I present for an Aus NC, is based on football boffins from Football Aus. It is not my personal opinion, although I've been influenced by persuasive arguments. I defer to football experts. Plus the Tech Depts of KNVB, Clarefontaine, German Football Fed and Spanish Football Fed, particularly Barca Academy, are the sources for our current football direction in Aus. They've addressed Aussie audiences, held workshops and coach education sessions/courses that I've attended in Aus. National systems have been deemed to work effectively in those powerhouse football nations over a sustained period. You exude a smugness that these practices are not suitable for Aus - or not working. If you want to disagree with the rationale and practice in those nations, and us following suit, it is your prerogative. Do you think we should adopt the Greek Football Fed's methodology in Aus instead of the four big powerhouses in Europe? Football Aus have had staff coaches visit Uruguay, Brazil, Argentina, and even Japan, to evaluate sound football methodological practices that can be extrapolated to Australia. Incorrect Decentric, I (and everyone else I assume) am very aware that you sing from the same old tired FFA hymn book. I just dont agree with the message nor the application. As for your barely disguised bigotry about "Greek football" methodology supposedly being championed by me because I am an Australian of Greek ancestry well, I guess that's your prerogative. A sad reflection on what "multiculturalism" really means in Australia in 2024... Thanks for the reminder. Geez you love playing the man not the ball dont you... Mate, not really... Im talking about Japan not having a bullshit national rulebook and relying on building clubs to better their football and old mate plays the "better than Greeks" card..... seriously? Everyone is entitled to their own opinion whether you agree with it or not, being divisive isnt the way to go about it. Fair enough point taken, Ill just have to put up with the slings and arrows then. MOE - have never posted before but read with interest most posts!! Talk about singing from the same hymn book!!! It's good to know that EVERYONE except you is racist!!!!
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? As others have stated, they have gone completely Brazilian in their methodology and NC. They and are about 15- 20 years down the pathway of their 50 year plan. They have invested big bucks in their system too. About 5 years ago Arsene Wenger anointed Japan as having a world class development system . In Aus there is no money for football development, and football development runs on an oily rag. I'm not sure who you are watching ATM? The younger Aussie players, 21 and under, coming through are very good technically. They are products of the new Aus development system, having been inculcated it for 10 years or so. I'd also anoint the entire Japanese football system overall, only outside the Big Seven leagues in world football. Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal may possibly be marginally in front of Japan too. Japan could even be in front of Switzerland, Croatia and Mexico. Thjey DONT have a NC Decentric... Their coaching system relies, at least at the base, quite heavily on volunteers and high schools and also runs quite frugaly. There are more than one way to skin a cat however Football Australia, seems to not even know what a cat looks like. I understand your "anointing" hither and tither, it is hard to be objective about something when you have been indoctrinated in the "system" and we can all be guilty of assuming our interpretation of issues is the correct one however Arsene Wenger, Hans Berger and Graham Arnold are not the football geniuses you want them to be. What you don't seem to be aware of , MOE, is that a lot of rationale that I present for an Aus NC, is based on football boffins from Football Aus. It is not my personal opinion, although I've been influenced by persuasive arguments. I defer to football experts. Plus the Tech Depts of KNVB, Clarefontaine, German Football Fed and Spanish Football Fed, particularly Barca Academy, are the sources for our current football direction in Aus. They've addressed Aussie audiences, held workshops and coach education sessions/courses that I've attended in Aus. National systems have been deemed to work effectively in those powerhouse football nations over a sustained period. You exude a smugness that these practices are not suitable for Aus - or not working. If you want to disagree with the rationale and practice in those nations, and us following suit, it is your prerogative. Do you think we should adopt the Greek Football Fed's methodology in Aus instead of the four big powerhouses in Europe? Football Aus have had staff coaches visit Uruguay, Brazil, Argentina, and even Japan, to evaluate sound football methodological practices that can be extrapolated to Australia. Incorrect Decentric, I (and everyone else I assume) am very aware that you sing from the same old tired FFA hymn book. I just dont agree with the message nor the application. As for your barely disguised bigotry about "Greek football" methodology supposedly being championed by me because I am an Australian of Greek ancestry well, I guess that's your prerogative. A sad reflection on what "multiculturalism" really means in Australia in 2024... Thanks for the reminder. Geez you love playing the man not the ball dont you... Mate, not really... Im talking about Japan not having a bullshit national rulebook and relying on building clubs to better their football and old mate plays the "better than Greeks" card..... seriously? Everyone is entitled to their own opinion whether you agree with it or not, being divisive isnt the way to go about it. Fair enough point taken, Ill just have to put up with the slings and arrows then.
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? They went Brazillian decades ago. There is also the cultural difference in terms of what type of player is seen as fitting their football culture that will also be the type that gets picked by youth coaches to progress up the junior ranks. I'm convinced our failures to produce technical players at the senior is more due to the coaches who choose physicality over footballing ability-that's our "culture". Sort of my point though. https://www.sbs.com.au/sport/article/asia-youth-development-japan-lead-the-way/3yawy7my1Main points for me: Whilst they do have a JFA "academy" that is pay to play most players are "developed" through J league and other club academies that are very price accessible No national "one size fits all" curriculumNational school tournaments are very big deal and some finals can get 50 thousand fans Both Germany and Belgium recently had a one size fits all curriculum. Germany's program yielded 3rd place in 2010 and Champions in 2014. Belgium's program didn't achieve the same results in tournaments, but it did produce some of the best footballers in the world of this generation. And both are rebuilding again, Germany won the u17 World Cup and have made some big changes at SSG level. Belgium also made big changes at SSG level earlier than Germany and seemingly starting to produce some very interesting young talent again. By focusing on development at club level rather than relying on federation perhaps? Is that what they're doing? I am not 100% sure but I do remember reading that the German Federation underwent a major restructure and part of the plan was to allow greater flexibility at club level... A few on here are either in Germany or associated with German football perhaps they can advise?
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Enzo Bearzot
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.5K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? They went Brazillian decades ago. There is also the cultural difference in terms of what type of player is seen as fitting their football culture that will also be the type that gets picked by youth coaches to progress up the junior ranks. I'm convinced our failures to produce technical players at the senior is more due to the coaches who choose physicality over footballing ability-that's our "culture". Sort of my point though. https://www.sbs.com.au/sport/article/asia-youth-development-japan-lead-the-way/3yawy7my1Main points for me: Whilst they do have a JFA "academy" that is pay to play most players are "developed" through J league and other club academies that are very price accessible No national "one size fits all" curriculumNational school tournaments are very big deal and some finals can get 50 thousand fans Both Germany and Belgium recently had a one size fits all curriculum. Germany's program yielded 3rd place in 2010 and Champions in 2014. Belgium's program didn't achieve the same results in tournaments, but it did produce some of the best footballers in the world of this generation. And both are rebuilding again, Germany won the u17 World Cup and have made some big changes at SSG level. Belgium also made big changes at SSG level earlier than Germany and seemingly starting to produce some very interesting young talent again. By focusing on development at club level rather than relying on federation perhaps? Is that what they're doing?
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Barca4Life
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 13K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? As others have stated, they have gone completely Brazilian in their methodology and NC. They and are about 15- 20 years down the pathway of their 50 year plan. They have invested big bucks in their system too. About 5 years ago Arsene Wenger anointed Japan as having a world class development system . In Aus there is no money for football development, and football development runs on an oily rag. I'm not sure who you are watching ATM? The younger Aussie players, 21 and under, coming through are very good technically. They are products of the new Aus development system, having been inculcated it for 10 years or so. I'd also anoint the entire Japanese football system overall, only outside the Big Seven leagues in world football. Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal may possibly be marginally in front of Japan too. Japan could even be in front of Switzerland, Croatia and Mexico. Thjey DONT have a NC Decentric... Their coaching system relies, at least at the base, quite heavily on volunteers and high schools and also runs quite frugaly. There are more than one way to skin a cat however Football Australia, seems to not even know what a cat looks like. I understand your "anointing" hither and tither, it is hard to be objective about something when you have been indoctrinated in the "system" and we can all be guilty of assuming our interpretation of issues is the correct one however Arsene Wenger, Hans Berger and Graham Arnold are not the football geniuses you want them to be. What you don't seem to be aware of , MOE, is that a lot of rationale that I present for an Aus NC, is based on football boffins from Football Aus. It is not my personal opinion, although I've been influenced by persuasive arguments. I defer to football experts. Plus the Tech Depts of KNVB, Clarefontaine, German Football Fed and Spanish Football Fed, particularly Barca Academy, are the sources for our current football direction in Aus. They've addressed Aussie audiences, held workshops and coach education sessions/courses that I've attended in Aus. National systems have been deemed to work effectively in those powerhouse football nations over a sustained period. You exude a smugness that these practices are not suitable for Aus - or not working. If you want to disagree with the rationale and practice in those nations, and us following suit, it is your prerogative. Do you think we should adopt the Greek Football Fed's methodology in Aus instead of the four big powerhouses in Europe? Football Aus have had staff coaches visit Uruguay, Brazil, Argentina, and even Japan, to evaluate sound football methodological practices that can be extrapolated to Australia. Incorrect Decentric, I (and everyone else I assume) am very aware that you sing from the same old tired FFA hymn book. I just dont agree with the message nor the application. As for your barely disguised bigotry about "Greek football" methodology supposedly being championed by me because I am an Australian of Greek ancestry well, I guess that's your prerogative. A sad reflection on what "multiculturalism" really means in Australia in 2024... Thanks for the reminder. Geez you love playing the man not the ball dont you... Mate, not really... Im talking about Japan not having a bullshit national rulebook and relying on building clubs to better their football and old mate plays the "better than Greeks" card..... seriously? Everyone is entitled to their own opinion whether you agree with it or not, being divisive isnt the way to go about it.
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? As others have stated, they have gone completely Brazilian in their methodology and NC. They and are about 15- 20 years down the pathway of their 50 year plan. They have invested big bucks in their system too. About 5 years ago Arsene Wenger anointed Japan as having a world class development system . In Aus there is no money for football development, and football development runs on an oily rag. I'm not sure who you are watching ATM? The younger Aussie players, 21 and under, coming through are very good technically. They are products of the new Aus development system, having been inculcated it for 10 years or so. I'd also anoint the entire Japanese football system overall, only outside the Big Seven leagues in world football. Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal may possibly be marginally in front of Japan too. Japan could even be in front of Switzerland, Croatia and Mexico. Thjey DONT have a NC Decentric... Their coaching system relies, at least at the base, quite heavily on volunteers and high schools and also runs quite frugaly. There are more than one way to skin a cat however Football Australia, seems to not even know what a cat looks like. I understand your "anointing" hither and tither, it is hard to be objective about something when you have been indoctrinated in the "system" and we can all be guilty of assuming our interpretation of issues is the correct one however Arsene Wenger, Hans Berger and Graham Arnold are not the football geniuses you want them to be. What you don't seem to be aware of , MOE, is that a lot of rationale that I present for an Aus NC, is based on football boffins from Football Aus. It is not my personal opinion, although I've been influenced by persuasive arguments. I defer to football experts. Plus the Tech Depts of KNVB, Clarefontaine, German Football Fed and Spanish Football Fed, particularly Barca Academy, are the sources for our current football direction in Aus. They've addressed Aussie audiences, held workshops and coach education sessions/courses that I've attended in Aus. National systems have been deemed to work effectively in those powerhouse football nations over a sustained period. You exude a smugness that these practices are not suitable for Aus - or not working. If you want to disagree with the rationale and practice in those nations, and us following suit, it is your prerogative. Do you think we should adopt the Greek Football Fed's methodology in Aus instead of the four big powerhouses in Europe? Football Aus have had staff coaches visit Uruguay, Brazil, Argentina, and even Japan, to evaluate sound football methodological practices that can be extrapolated to Australia. Incorrect Decentric, I (and everyone else I assume) am very aware that you sing from the same old tired FFA hymn book. I just dont agree with the message nor the application. As for your barely disguised bigotry about "Greek football" methodology supposedly being championed by me because I am an Australian of Greek ancestry well, I guess that's your prerogative. A sad reflection on what "multiculturalism" really means in Australia in 2024... Thanks for the reminder. Geez you love playing the man not the ball dont you... Mate, not really... Im talking about Japan not having a bullshit national rulebook and relying on building clubs to better their football and old mate plays the "better than Greeks" card..... seriously?
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Monoethnic Social Club
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? They went Brazillian decades ago. There is also the cultural difference in terms of what type of player is seen as fitting their football culture that will also be the type that gets picked by youth coaches to progress up the junior ranks. I'm convinced our failures to produce technical players at the senior is more due to the coaches who choose physicality over footballing ability-that's our "culture". Sort of my point though. https://www.sbs.com.au/sport/article/asia-youth-development-japan-lead-the-way/3yawy7my1Main points for me: Whilst they do have a JFA "academy" that is pay to play most players are "developed" through J league and other club academies that are very price accessible No national "one size fits all" curriculumNational school tournaments are very big deal and some finals can get 50 thousand fans Both Germany and Belgium recently had a one size fits all curriculum. Germany's program yielded 3rd place in 2010 and Champions in 2014. Belgium's program didn't achieve the same results in tournaments, but it did produce some of the best footballers in the world of this generation. And both are rebuilding again, Germany won the u17 World Cup and have made some big changes at SSG level. Belgium also made big changes at SSG level earlier than Germany and seemingly starting to produce some very interesting young talent again. By focusing on development at club level rather than relying on federation perhaps?
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Enzo Bearzot
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That's interesting. Do you know what the changes they've made are?
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Barca4Life
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? As others have stated, they have gone completely Brazilian in their methodology and NC. They and are about 15- 20 years down the pathway of their 50 year plan. They have invested big bucks in their system too. About 5 years ago Arsene Wenger anointed Japan as having a world class development system . In Aus there is no money for football development, and football development runs on an oily rag. I'm not sure who you are watching ATM? The younger Aussie players, 21 and under, coming through are very good technically. They are products of the new Aus development system, having been inculcated it for 10 years or so. I'd also anoint the entire Japanese football system overall, only outside the Big Seven leagues in world football. Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal may possibly be marginally in front of Japan too. Japan could even be in front of Switzerland, Croatia and Mexico. Thjey DONT have a NC Decentric... Their coaching system relies, at least at the base, quite heavily on volunteers and high schools and also runs quite frugaly. There are more than one way to skin a cat however Football Australia, seems to not even know what a cat looks like. I understand your "anointing" hither and tither, it is hard to be objective about something when you have been indoctrinated in the "system" and we can all be guilty of assuming our interpretation of issues is the correct one however Arsene Wenger, Hans Berger and Graham Arnold are not the football geniuses you want them to be. What you don't seem to be aware of , MOE, is that a lot of rationale that I present for an Aus NC, is based on football boffins from Football Aus. It is not my personal opinion, although I've been influenced by persuasive arguments. I defer to football experts. Plus the Tech Depts of KNVB, Clarefontaine, German Football Fed and Spanish Football Fed, particularly Barca Academy, are the sources for our current football direction in Aus. They've addressed Aussie audiences, held workshops and coach education sessions/courses that I've attended in Aus. National systems have been deemed to work effectively in those powerhouse football nations over a sustained period. You exude a smugness that these practices are not suitable for Aus - or not working. If you want to disagree with the rationale and practice in those nations, and us following suit, it is your prerogative. Do you think we should adopt the Greek Football Fed's methodology in Aus instead of the four big powerhouses in Europe? Football Aus have had staff coaches visit Uruguay, Brazil, Argentina, and even Japan, to evaluate sound football methodological practices that can be extrapolated to Australia. Incorrect Decentric, I (and everyone else I assume) am very aware that you sing from the same old tired FFA hymn book. I just dont agree with the message nor the application. As for your barely disguised bigotry about "Greek football" methodology supposedly being championed by me because I am an Australian of Greek ancestry well, I guess that's your prerogative. A sad reflection on what "multiculturalism" really means in Australia in 2024... Thanks for the reminder. Geez you love playing the man not the ball dont you...
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Barca4Life
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 13K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? They went Brazillian decades ago. There is also the cultural difference in terms of what type of player is seen as fitting their football culture that will also be the type that gets picked by youth coaches to progress up the junior ranks. I'm convinced our failures to produce technical players at the senior is more due to the coaches who choose physicality over footballing ability-that's our "culture". Sort of my point though. https://www.sbs.com.au/sport/article/asia-youth-development-japan-lead-the-way/3yawy7my1Main points for me: Whilst they do have a JFA "academy" that is pay to play most players are "developed" through J league and other club academies that are very price accessible No national "one size fits all" curriculumNational school tournaments are very big deal and some finals can get 50 thousand fans Both Germany and Belgium recently had a one size fits all curriculum. Germany's program yielded 3rd place in 2010 and Champions in 2014. Belgium's program didn't achieve the same results in tournaments, but it did produce some of the best footballers in the world of this generation. And both are rebuilding again, Germany won the u17 World Cup and have made some big changes at SSG level. Belgium also made big changes at SSG level earlier than Germany and seemingly starting to produce some very interesting young talent again.
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Monoethnic Social Club
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+xIf we look objectively, we have some very disappointing results against minnows. Ergo, our recent game against India. Similarly, we have had some very good results against more favoured teams, especially in the past World Cup. There is a theme going on here. Not only have we become better organized in defending against better teams, and snagged the good result here and there, we similarly have found it more and more difficult to break down lesser teams. I suspect overall the skill sets of all teams have improved on what existed 20 years ago, hence it is getting harder for superior teams to consistently score heavily against the minnows. Hitting teams on the break and scoring against the run of play isnt a direct result of technical players.....
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Monoethnic Social Club
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? As others have stated, they have gone completely Brazilian in their methodology and NC. They and are about 15- 20 years down the pathway of their 50 year plan. They have invested big bucks in their system too. About 5 years ago Arsene Wenger anointed Japan as having a world class development system . In Aus there is no money for football development, and football development runs on an oily rag. I'm not sure who you are watching ATM? The younger Aussie players, 21 and under, coming through are very good technically. They are products of the new Aus development system, having been inculcated it for 10 years or so. I'd also anoint the entire Japanese football system overall, only outside the Big Seven leagues in world football. Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal may possibly be marginally in front of Japan too. Japan could even be in front of Switzerland, Croatia and Mexico. Thjey DONT have a NC Decentric... Their coaching system relies, at least at the base, quite heavily on volunteers and high schools and also runs quite frugaly. There are more than one way to skin a cat however Football Australia, seems to not even know what a cat looks like. I understand your "anointing" hither and tither, it is hard to be objective about something when you have been indoctrinated in the "system" and we can all be guilty of assuming our interpretation of issues is the correct one however Arsene Wenger, Hans Berger and Graham Arnold are not the football geniuses you want them to be. Here are some of the progenitors of the football methodology the NC is based on - Rinus Michels, Michael Platini, Victor Maslov, Valery Lobanovski, Tito Vilanova, Johann Cruyff, Louis Van Gaal. Which 'football geniuses' do you think Australia needs to improve us further, that I haven't mentioned? Football Aus have discarded the ideas of Angel Herrerra, Charles Reep and Charles Hughes. The former's concepts have been discarded because they don't the suit the Aussie psyche or mentality. The latter two, because their ideas have not extrapolated to success in international football over a sustained period. I dont think there ARE any football geniuses, at least not int he way you want to apl,ly them anyway. Coaches and methodologies are of their time and come and go in cyclical fashion... Football evolves and changes sometimes in the span of one season let alone over decades.. Pep isnt playing Barca era Tiki Taka with Man City now is he? The "progenitors" you mention have, amongst themselves, vastly different philosophies of the game which have also adapted over time, absolutely fine to say that various aspects of coaching can be attributed to information gleamed from them but football isnt some high school history project where you can dump info from a bunch of different sources and "create" an assignment.... Give us YOUR opinion, football specific trained knowledge withstanding, not the ramblings of Platini (who coached France in the 8 year period they failed to qualify for a World Cup) or Van Gal the slug who single highhandedlyandedly destroyed the last true #10 hook the world has ever seen simple because he didn't like him at Barca and instructed a fairly solid Dutch side not to bother marking Messi in as he offered nothing in BPO" ... what a remarkable mind for football). Football Australia might feel the need for an "Anthology of losers" to direct to evolution of our sport here but I think Japan has something far greater to offer and, it looks like the building blocks of their success is to have more clubs NOT some bullshit focus group of librarians.
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Hillbilly55
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If we look objectively, we have some very disappointing results against minnows. Ergo, our recent game against India. Similarly, we have had some very good results against more favoured teams, especially in the past World Cup. There is a theme going on here.
Not only have we become better organized in defending against better teams, and snagged the good result here and there, we similarly have found it more and more difficult to break down lesser teams. I suspect overall the skill sets of all teams have improved on what existed 20 years ago, hence it is getting harder for superior teams to consistently score heavily against the minnows.
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? They went Brazillian decades ago. There is also the cultural difference in terms of what type of player is seen as fitting their football culture that will also be the type that gets picked by youth coaches to progress up the junior ranks. I'm convinced our failures to produce technical players at the senior is more due to the coaches who choose physicality over footballing ability-that's our "culture". Sort of my point though. https://www.sbs.com.au/sport/article/asia-youth-development-japan-lead-the-way/3yawy7my1Main points for me: Whilst they do have a JFA "academy" that is pay to play most players are "developed" through J league and other club academies that are very price accessible No national "one size fits all" curriculum National school tournaments are very big deal and some finals can get 50 thousand fans It comes down to culture. We get the Socceroos we deserve, and it starts all the way down on the bottom rung. Take Irvine and Duke, two key starters for Arnold's starting eleven. Duke has been playing in the lower Leagues in Japan for years. Yet not one of the clubs in the top tier of Japanese football wants him. Lets be clear- he is our starting striker, and scored in the World Cup. Not one top tier J-League club wants him. The there's Jackson Irvine- captain. He would never make a single Japanese NT, like ever, or at least in the last 30 years. Why do you think that is? No arguments here... Talent identification and development is and has been abysmal for a very long time.... Its NOT just on FFA, the Soccer Australia era is not blameless either....
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? As others have stated, they have gone completely Brazilian in their methodology and NC. They and are about 15- 20 years down the pathway of their 50 year plan. They have invested big bucks in their system too. About 5 years ago Arsene Wenger anointed Japan as having a world class development system . In Aus there is no money for football development, and football development runs on an oily rag. I'm not sure who you are watching ATM? The younger Aussie players, 21 and under, coming through are very good technically. They are products of the new Aus development system, having been inculcated it for 10 years or so. I'd also anoint the entire Japanese football system overall, only outside the Big Seven leagues in world football. Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal may possibly be marginally in front of Japan too. Japan could even be in front of Switzerland, Croatia and Mexico. Thjey DONT have a NC Decentric... Their coaching system relies, at least at the base, quite heavily on volunteers and high schools and also runs quite frugaly. There are more than one way to skin a cat however Football Australia, seems to not even know what a cat looks like. I understand your "anointing" hither and tither, it is hard to be objective about something when you have been indoctrinated in the "system" and we can all be guilty of assuming our interpretation of issues is the correct one however Arsene Wenger, Hans Berger and Graham Arnold are not the football geniuses you want them to be. Here are some of the progenitors of the football methodology the NC is based on - Rinus Michels, Michael Platini, Victor Maslov, Valery Lobanovski, Tito Vilanova, Johann Cruyff, Louis Van Gaal. Which 'football geniuses' do you think Australia needs to improve us further, that I haven't mentioned? Football Aus have discarded the ideas of Angel Herrerra, Charles Reep and Charles Hughes. The former's concepts have been discarded because they don't the suit the Aussie psyche or mentality. The latter two, because their ideas have not extrapolated to success in international football over a sustained period. Has it ever been defined 1. what the Aussie pysche or mentality actually is, and 2. how unique it is? Apparently "mateship" is only something that occurs between english speaking people and athleticism and physicality is a uniquely Australian trait?
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Monoethnic Social Club
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? They went Brazillian decades ago. There is also the cultural difference in terms of what type of player is seen as fitting their football culture that will also be the type that gets picked by youth coaches to progress up the junior ranks. I'm convinced our failures to produce technical players at the senior is more due to the coaches who choose physicality over footballing ability-that's our "culture". Sort of my point though. https://www.sbs.com.au/sport/article/asia-youth-development-japan-lead-the-way/3yawy7my1Main points for me: Whilst they do have a JFA "academy" that is pay to play most players are "developed" through J league and other club academies that are very price accessible No national "one size fits all" curriculumNational school tournaments are very big deal and some finals can get 50 thousand fans Both Germany and Belgium recently had a one size fits all curriculum. Germany's program yielded 3rd place in 2010 and Champions in 2014. Belgium's program didn't achieve the same results in tournaments, but it did produce some of the best footballers in the world of this generation. And now?
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Monoethnic Social Club
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xWe struggled against India says it all at this stage. We struggled to score but apart from their one good chance from the header they did not threaten us.Credit to them for committment in their defending but their game plan was all about limiting the score. The first game in a tournament is always difficult as many better teams than us have found in WCs so getting the win is paramount. Given this is wrong thread, good to see posters like you post the realistic and positive response to Aus's start against India, Booney. Thankfully, there is now an emerging cohort of educated football fans and stakeholders in Aus, who embrace the Asian football milieu - and all the benefits for Aus football. If you saw the India game as a "positive start" to the competition Decentric then your precious FFA accreditation isnt worth the photocopy paper it was printed on.... The educated cohort milieu of embracing stakeholders can all hold hands and chant their jargony phrases till the mythical "11th in the world cup" result is repeated but that first half against India was probably the worst thing I have seen in 2 decades. Agree that 1st half was horrific. Aaron Mooy is big loss of skill in midfield. But Arnold really needs to get over hacking players like Duke, Behich, Baccus, Jones etc. 2nd half saved by McGree and Boyle finally providing some service I think Baccus and O'Neill are playing the Mooy role quite well. It is more of a question of muscular, power midfielders like Irvine and Metcalfe, being exposed trying to play through a compact block - when we had the ball. Also, Goodwin needs to play at his best. Boyle often tries to beat players by outpacing them, which rarely works and he gets knocked off his feet a lot. With the 21 and under whizz generation coming through, the likes of Irvine will never be selected for Aus in the future. He just hasn't acquired the first touch to play Big Five. The best he can do in rapidfire ball circulation, is the one touch pass. If there is enough time he has good body position for the one foot pass to teammates in confined space. Where Irvine breaks down, is the two touch receive and pass. The first touch is often to take the ball away from one's marker. The second touch is passing the ball. His handling speed he is too slow, and his footwork is inadequate. It was very frustrating watching him against India, despite his other qualities. O'Neill is our best at two touch and one touch passing, like Mooy prior. The entire Japanese team is brilliant at this. They have 8 Big Five players, possibly heaps of footballers in the 30 odd big clubs in modest UEFA leagues, and the J league must be really good too. Japan's ball circulation is so much quicker than other Asian Cup teams. Which leads to the OBVIOUS question how are they doing so if they dont have the technical panacea of the KNVB and Clairfontaine like our whizz bang technicians do? As others have stated, they have gone completely Brazilian in their methodology and NC. They and are about 15- 20 years down the pathway of their 50 year plan. They have invested big bucks in their system too. About 5 years ago Arsene Wenger anointed Japan as having a world class development system . In Aus there is no money for football development, and football development runs on an oily rag. I'm not sure who you are watching ATM? The younger Aussie players, 21 and under, coming through are very good technically. They are products of the new Aus development system, having been inculcated it for 10 years or so. I'd also anoint the entire Japanese football system overall, only outside the Big Seven leagues in world football. Netherlands, Belgium, Portugal may possibly be marginally in front of Japan too. Japan could even be in front of Switzerland, Croatia and Mexico. Thjey DONT have a NC Decentric... Their coaching system relies, at least at the base, quite heavily on volunteers and high schools and also runs quite frugaly. There are more than one way to skin a cat however Football Australia, seems to not even know what a cat looks like. I understand your "anointing" hither and tither, it is hard to be objective about something when you have been indoctrinated in the "system" and we can all be guilty of assuming our interpretation of issues is the correct one however Arsene Wenger, Hans Berger and Graham Arnold are not the football geniuses you want them to be. What you don't seem to be aware of , MOE, is that a lot of rationale that I present for an Aus NC, is based on football boffins from Football Aus. It is not my personal opinion, although I've been influenced by persuasive arguments. I defer to football experts. Plus the Tech Depts of KNVB, Clarefontaine, German Football Fed and Spanish Football Fed, particularly Barca Academy, are the sources for our current football direction in Aus. They've addressed Aussie audiences, held workshops and coach education sessions/courses that I've attended in Aus. National systems have been deemed to work effectively in those powerhouse football nations over a sustained period. You exude a smugness that these practices are not suitable for Aus - or not working. If you want to disagree with the rationale and practice in those nations, and us following suit, it is your prerogative. Do you think we should adopt the Greek Football Fed's methodology in Aus instead of the four big powerhouses in Europe? Football Aus have had staff coaches visit Uruguay, Brazil, Argentina, and even Japan, to evaluate sound football methodological practices that can be extrapolated to Australia. Incorrect Decentric, I (and everyone else I assume) am very aware that you sing from the same old tired FFA hymn book. I just dont agree with the message nor the application. As for your barely disguised bigotry about "Greek football" methodology supposedly being championed by me because I am an Australian of Greek ancestry well, I guess that's your prerogative. A sad reflection on what "multiculturalism" really means in Australia in 2024... Thanks for the reminder.
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