Think there may be more to it. A loss of form usually means for several months. Renshaw's has been lost for at least 12 months. It looks like a confidence issue to me. Some take longer to bounce back from adversity than others. Must have been a huge blow to him when he was dropped from the side. I heard he had run ins with Langer over being late for training too. That certainly will put you off side with a coach. 

I addressed this in an earlier post. 

Because of Cummins’ fatigue, where his average speed is dropping from Test to Test, rest him and retain Starc. 

Bring in Patto to replace Cummins. 

If Lyon has a finger injury, we could replace him with Holland, or Siddle. 

I am not sure if Labu, Smith and Head could perform the back up spin though? 

Is there a way to post an image here. I have one of our boys belting out Underneath the Southern Cross.

Informative post, Baggers. 

I’m sure Langer can realise Renshaw’s potential if he evaluates his Test performances. 

Not good if that is CA’s thinking. 

If Usman is younger than Warner, I’d prefer to see him open instead. 

I liked.. firstly that Tim had confidence in bringing Marnus in at a crucial time in the match and secondly the way he bowled using his bouncy leggies into the footmarks. It showed the heart for the battle that this little guy possesses. I had hoped Smithy had tidied up his bowling as he gives it a big tweak. He is a touch tidier but still can not build sufficient pressure to be any more than a part time option.

I have Siddle playing as a swan song for the big-hearted Vicco. Not sure who he replaces. Starc is my choice as his three wickets were at @31 while his strike rate was almost 60. DC even if Cummins pace has dropped he is still a serious competitor. He has plenty of time to recuperate before his next test match on Nov 21..

I reckon they will bring Khawaja back in for Warner. Pattinson for Starc.

Issue with Renshaw is his peak wasn't great either. He can bat time but honestly he is average at best

Peter Handscomb. Is his technique solid enough at Test level or is it flimsy as per his reputation? I haven’t watched much of him 

He had a good first  test season at home.

Then Hanscomb struggled away and at home since that first successful season when he played test cricket.

Thought Starc did enough against the Poms at Old Trafford.

His technique is definitely an issue if the pitch is doing anything at all, so always.

With regards to openers this makes interesting reading Here is the list of best openers in the last 2 years in the world

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?batting_positionmax1=2;batting_positionmin1=1;batting_positionval1=batting_position;class=1;filter=advanced;orderby=batting_average;qualmin1=2;qualval1=matches;spanmin1=05+Sep+2017;spanval1=span;template=results;type=batting

Every team in the world would love to have Burns opening for them, yet he can't even get a tour position. Our other opener is Khawaja, so with a top 4 of Burns Warner and Khawaja and Smith puts our batting line up as arguably the best in the world. Don't believe me here is the top 3 batting positions in the world in the last 3 years.

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?batting_positionmax1=3;batting_positionmin1=1;batting_positionval1=batting_position;class=1;filter=advanced;orderby=batting_average;qualmin1=2;qualval1=matches;spanmin1=05+Sep+2017;spanval1=span;template=results;type=batting

By the time you get to Warner we have 4 in the top 22 Burns NO 1 Position for Australia (can't make touring party) Labuchagne ( just starting his career) Khawaja (now dropped) and Warner.

England have 2 Bairstow and Jack Leach who are playing for England but aren't batting in the top order.

NZ have 2 in Williamson and Latham both excellent batsmen and Paddles would probably agree if they had Burns it would be a great top 3.

India would challenge Australia for that best in the world tag with 3 Shaw, Pujara and Agarwal but believe it or not Pujara and Agarwal are only there because of the hatchet job they did on the best in the world bowling attack in Australia where Shaw did not play Pujara is averaging 15 (better than Warner) since then and Agarwal is averaging 20 since then. So their averages are somewhat inflated on a world basis where other bowling sides get them out quite comfortably. This is something Burns et al don't get the opportunity to inflate their averages as they don't get to play against this particular bowling attack.

South Africa have Markram Elgar and De Bruyn but De Bruyn only has an 20 overall average

Sri Lanka have 3 in Mendis, Fernando and Karunaratne and it shows when they took on South Africa in South Africa. But they did struggle against Richardson, Starc, Cummins and Lyon but Fernando wasn't in that side.

Then you can add Smith probably the best batsmen in the world.

Then you can look at the tail where Australia holds its own in the batting department, not as good as NZ, England but this is an area where SA and India drop off, they don't have batsmen like Pattinson and to a lesser extent Cummins and Starc.

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?batting_positionmax1=11;batting_positionmin1=8;batting_positionval1=batting_position;class=1;filter=advanced;orderby=batting_average;qualmin1=2;qualval1=matches;spanmin1=05+Sep+2017;spanval1=span;template=results;type=batting

But that is more a statement about the quality of batting world wide, it is currently appalling that is why we see so many bowlers world wide with low averages. Here is the list of bowlers with averages under 27 in the last 2 years.

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?class=1;filter=advanced;orderby=bowling_average;qualmax1=27;qualmin1=1;qualval1=bowling_average;spanmin1=05+sep+2015;spanval1=span;template=results;type=bowling

That's 61 bowlers world wide that is how bad the batting is currently on a world wide level. Was there ever a time there were so many? maybe back in the 70's, but I can't remember if that is right either. There are bowlers there that I've never heard of and I do follow world cricket not just Australia. Paddles probably knows them all, but I certainly don't. Ireland have 3 in the top 20 or so. For Australia we have Richardson as our best and he did play against one of the best batting sides in the world in Sri Lanka, Pat Cummins, Agar (who would have thought), and on page 2 (so not even in top 50) we have Pattinson, O'Keefe, Starc and Labuchagne. No Josh Hazlewood even with his performance so far in England. Surely this puts into perspective the absurdity of the tag "world best attack". If I was to say Ireland has the best bowling attack in the world you'd lock me in the funny farm and throw away the key, but in reality they do have 3 bowlers in the top 24 and Australia has 0. That's 24 bowlers with better averages in the last 2 years than our best, who is not Cummins, but is Jhye Richardson.

You also have to question any "ranking system" that doesn't have Rabada as the No 1 Bowler in the world currently with 176 wickets in the last 2 years with a SR of 38 is incredible. Think about it 37 matches 69 innings 176 @21.77 SR 38, that's only 5 wickets less than Hazlewood which has taken him 48 tests 88 innings to achieve. Rabada is a bowling machine and has had to compete with Philander, Olivier, Steyn, Morkel, and Abbott for the opportunity to take those wickets. And they're all accounted for in the above list. Unlike Cummins whose bowling partners in Pattinson and Starc struggle to make the list and Hazlewood isn't even on the list. Cummins is getting a lot more opportunities to take wickets because someone has to, and Starc and Hazlewood are struggling in that department. Cummins wouldn't have taken as many as he has if he was bowling after Philander and Rabada, they're cleaning up.

So when we lose a test like we did against England in the 3rd test and so called experts blame the batting they are so wrong it's not funny. Even when losing tests the batsmen are up amongst the best in the world. Blame the selectors for not choosing the best players if you wish but the reality is if players like Warner and Khawaja are failing and they are among the best in the world then it was the opposition bowlers who are performing well. It is up to Australia to counter punch and bowl the opposition batsmen, who are under performing on a worldwide scale in comparison to our own, out. It is the bowlers who failed to live up to expectations as they do on a world wide scale, as they did against India, as they did against Pakistan, as they did against SA. 

The reality is the batsmen are performing to the extent they could be considered the best in the world even without Smith, Smith is the icing on the cake that gives an invincible tag. It is the bowling attack that has let us down and are not worthy of the tag "best in the world" because they are not.

Paddles I know you won't say certain things on an Australian cricket site, being a New Zealander and all, but as an Australian I'll say it.

I believe the non selection of Burns in the touring party was a joke and there is some unknown motive behind this by CA after-all no million dollar CA contract was given to an incumbent opener coming off 180 in his last test and I think in the next few months we will see why with CA who is governed by NSWCA probably pushing an agenda. There has never been any intention of playing Burns regardless of what he does on the field. For the last 5 years he has always been in the leading run scorers at Sheffield Shield, whereas others have a good season, followed by a poor one, such as Harris, Bancroft, Renshaw, Finch.

The dropping of Khawaja was scapegoat BS hiding the fact that the bowlers lost the 3rd test by allowing an 80 run final wicket to occur. Australia had them 9/286 so anyone that says that 362 was not enough runs and it is the batsmen fault is full of it, it was poor bowling pure and simple. This was no fault of Pattinson who never got the ball in those final overs, and in the last 2 years you can see that if this sort of partnership was to occur it could only be against the Australian bowlers who have proven to be inconsistent in their wicket taking ability compared to what others are doing and there are many in a world wide aspect. The "best bowling attack in the world" tag is either stupidity or arrogance, you choose, and belittles other proven on-field performers in the world. Or maybe it's just trying to hide how poor England is at the moment.

The perseverance with Warner is fine with me as long as he starts to perform when back in Australia, but he is a proven failure when playing away from home, so that should be taken into consideration when choosing future touring parties. Khawaja should come in and open in the next test, nothing to lose so try it.

This is amazing, Mike!

Your research to find data is astonishing.

To think Australia has a high performing top four is unbelievable!

Nevertheless, all your stats  on Hazlewood which showed he has struggled to take wickets with the older ball influenced me to think he was a poorer bowler than he is. I had read other stats to show his results in the the  last year in Tests have been mediocre as well though .

In the last two Ashes Tests H has been very good though. I'm assuming, from what I saw, that H took middle order wickets generating some reverse swing. He also bowled very fast by his own standards, reaching 145 kph.

I dont. He had the one good spell. Figures reflect his inconsistency. @31.5 - 57s/r. The bloke is toast. I want Cummins, Hazlewood, Jhye Richardson and Pattinson as our attack for the summer. But Starc will be picked as lefties add balance. Oh for a consistent leftie then. Is Behrendorff able to play a five day game?

This has to be blatant paranoia, Mike!


Wade has been appraised as being unlikely to perform at a higher level, Tests, as a batter, even though he has batted well at a lower level - Shield cricket.

To be impartial, the selectors may have been correct in their Wade evaluation.

Dorff is a pop gun, who swings a new ball and then becomes innocuous.

I've seen him play Shield cricket at Bellerive a bit. He is one of the plethora of Aussie mediocre fast bowlers, who look great in the Shield, but will be innocuous in international red ball cricket.

I'd have to disagree.

When he was selected and in form, I saw him bat longer than most of his Aussie team-mates who struggled in the Subcontinent.

Renshaw's defence was sound - a rare quality in most of our batters.

 Maybe he didn't  score quickly enough, but he was able to keep his wicket intact under great pressure when team-mates were falling around  him.

From what Langer is saying publicly, it is unlikely.

That's not quite what he is saying. He is saying Burns got dropped (when the whole batting order was slashed, Voges, Fergo, Smarsh I think in 2016 all axed) after called up in emergency, did alright, and got dropped for a guy who had never done alright, and another guy who has never done alright (Bancroft). And in this time made some runs in domestic. In the meantime, Khawaja as an emergency fill in in the UAE, against Abbas of all bowlers, did alright, but got shunted down the order, and has not done alright.

The problem with that list of openers, though, is that many many many small samples. And it becomes apparent to me, there is no set opening pair in the world bar Safrica. That's the end of the list. (Raval will be dropped for NZ soon cos we have Will Young - but he is getting serugery rehab right now). India's Shaw, on a drug ban right now, is expected by them to be the new Sehwag. Well Sehwag was great in Asia, dominant even, but he didn't do well in greener pastures. They have noone set to partner him, Afarwal, Rahul, Dhawan, Vijay have all failed, and Rohit is expected to get a chance soon. Latham for NZ has not done anything in greener fields either, he has been brilliant at minnow bashing and setting up great performances in Asia, his record in UAE and SL are his real gems. But he has gone missing in big SENA games. He does have the knack of when getting a 100, going huge. 150, 200, 250+ scores. When he cashes in, he sets the game up. Ul Haq's nephew will bat with Farkhar for a while longer, but they do have quality batsmen in reserve waiting a chance.

Anyway this will get off topic, right now, so I'll stop, globally batsmen are struggling as pitches have become deadly in Asia and WI, and the quality of seam bowling has rarely ever been this high since. The only roads left are arguably in NZ and Aus. And everyone seems to have some serious Aces in their bowling attack. And the openers list really confirms that. Kunratne for SL is excellent and Markram carries a lot of Safrican hopes. 

But the Joe Burns story does look a bit odd from a selection point of view. 

Mike, Pujara is a fine batsman in Asia as well. One of the best going. 

It is the bowlers who failed to live up to expectations as they do on a world wide scale

More rubbish Mike. If it was not for Cummins and Hazlewood we will not be bringing the urn home (figuratively speaking). It certainly is not due to our batsmen (Smith excluded). Had we had half decent bats against the moving ball we'd win this 5-0. You bring up an absurd situation to make your point.. that being loosing the unloseable when Stokes tonked us out of the game. The operative word being tonked.. He was in white ball mode for much of the last hour. Good pitched balls from both Haze and Cummins that were troubling batsmen only hours before were being stepped away from and clubbed white ball style by a powerful man with a decent eye.

That is surprising.

It is. There is one, Elgar and Markram for SA.  Raval is staring down the barrell of being dropped for NZ cos the replacement has already been groomed last season. He is just in surgical rehab right now.

The bowlers are too good globally and the batting conditions too difficult for many right now. 

I keep saying - this is the best era for bowlers I have seen since I was a small fry, and all the stats support this. Noone bar Kohli, AbDV (now retired), KW and his excellency Smith have made batting look easy. Noone else. These guy are literally look like they're playing a different game, with Smith leading the way as though he is playing tennis. Everyone else is sucking or fighting tenaciously like Kurnuratne and Pujara. For lack of a better phrase.

Root's numbers over the past few years have collapsed. Cook took early retirement. To break the top 5 batsmen in the world now, a less than 45 career average (he debut'd in 2016) is doing it for Nicholls.

This is Steve Smith's ashes. Cmon. Twin centuries in the first game, set it up for Lyon, you win without Haze). Goes a long way to making sure you won't lose the second before injury. He misses a game, you lose it (you play Haze), cos your bowlers couldn't seal.

Smith comes back, scores a double century, and an 80, to make sure England would never get close.

This whole Ashes was Stokes v Smith. Advantage Smith. 

If England win the final test and Stokes does something brilliant, I'd share mots imo. But Smith has carried Australia, and Stokes has carried England. 

For all the pontification about Paine, his captaincy and selection, and perplexing  calls to reinstate Smith as captain, because of his recent performances, I'm bemused.




*  Paine scored 80 odd runs under pressure, for 1 dismissal in the 4th Test.

Outside Smith, have any of the top 6 exceeded this as a specialist batter in  Ashes tests 1-4 with an average of 80 odd?





* Paine's brother, Nick, wrote in the local Murdoch tabloid, and I've seen it reiterated,  that Langer has conceived a meticulous plan of action to win The Ashes. His right hand man has been Paine to carry these plans out on the pitch. The team as a unit is better  ATM than it has ever been in most of the current players' Test careers.

I've seen it written repeatedly, that Paine's four year absence from professional  cricket, and experience of life as a civilian absent from the Aus team bubble, and Cummins' 5-6 year injury sabbatical as a student, has kept their team-mates far more grounded particularly since Langer's tenure. 

Langer, and the current leadership of Paine and Cummins, as captain and VC of this Test team, has been instrumental in a metamorphosis since the ASA ball tampering.



* Furthermore, It has also been advanced by current and former teammates, that Smith, who suffers from ADHD, was never comfortable  with  media  scrutiny of captaincy. Conversely, Paine is impervious to  media pressure , and unflustered  in dealing with captaincy pressures. He has also come from a Tasmanian Shield dream, with no egos, led by George Bailey, with Paine often being his deputy. He has learnt a lot about player management.

Paine may not be as good a tactician as Ian Chappell or Michael Clarke, but he  is the right man for the job. After SA ball tampering, who could imagine  us  retaining The Ashes in England now?

Openers are Australia's achilles heel at the moment. This Ashes is making that painfully obvious. Every one used has been an abject failure.. which proves all are weak as against the moving ball.. still. We all know why that is.. a plethora of white ball cricket. Warner for instance.. unless mistaken.. played IT20 even before he played shield. Our current batch of openers either throw away their wicket when set or have glaring technical probs borne of poor coaching as juniors. It is obvious Australian decks mask the real deficiencies in our batting. Last season's best opener was Marcus Harris. We have just seen what a moving ball does to his technique. In fact there were four openers in the top 10 runs list. Three others were Alex Doolan, Dan Hughes and Nick Larkin. Would they have done a better job than Bancroft, Harris or Warner? We will never know. The three at least have acceptable techniques. Of the three only Doolan has played Test cricket. I believe Dan Hughes has the game to play international cricket.. Uncertain about Larkin at this stage. 

I was going to respond, Paddles, but with my former Moderator hat on,  unless we are discussing England and Aus in regards of the 5th Test, some of your posts ( although always being very informative) belong to the International Cricket or General Cricket discussion, mate.

The discussion  is digressing.

Most informative DC.
Paine deserves a huge pat on the back for the way he has returned respect to the Australian cricket brand. He has copped heaps of flack over his captaincy.. as it turned out.. much of it unwarranted. As the man has led the team that has returned the urn to these shores after almost 20 years absence. An achievement even greats Ricky Ponting and  Michael Clarke were unable to do.

It is probably a good point, Baggers.

I have watched  Alex Doolan bat a lot live at Bellerive and he he is not Test quality as an opener.

He gets caught on strike , unable to rotate it and to take singles. His defence (unlike Renshaw's at his best) is shaky, probably through lack of concentration. 

Outside Pucovski, given Smith's unorthodoxy,   Doolan is the most stylish player in Australia. He  also has a Test 90, but like Paine , he finds ways to get out when he is set and  gets bogged down with tight bowling.  His issue is concentration and lack of confidence in his own ability.

There are plenty of others like him.

All good, and totally agreed, I am trying to get Mike to find his way in there with me.

Further, Smith is unable to be reinstated as cap until after your home summer, if not later than. 

So its not an option for this summer anyway. 

Warner was banned forever from leadership roles. 

I actually wonder, post Paine, if Cummins is given a chance at it. Rare for a fast bowler - I know.