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numklpkgulftumch
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Ideal league is 20 teams
38 weeks
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libelous
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+x+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. It's just desparation from the AL clubs. Facing the prospect of a second division which will in all likelyhood have a tiny fraction of the licensing fees of the AL. The license fees will probably be to cover the shared operating expenses of the league, not the utterly fictious valutation of a license nominated by the AL which is copying the MLS's ponzi scheme as well as a street vendor's Rollex. This is their last gasp attempt to suck out whatever latent investment is around before they have a choice with the extremely high cost AL and the low buy in NSD. Anyone with that sort of play money isn't going to scare themselves into paying 30 million to meet AL's deadline. Boiler room bullshit. I believe that the NSD (NST) will become the top tier within 5 years as A league franchises fold or opt to join the less costly league. Then the re alignment of the pyramid will begin in earnest.
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bohemia
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Group: Forum Members
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+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. It's just desparation from the AL clubs. Facing the prospect of a second division which will in all likelyhood have a tiny fraction of the licensing fees of the AL. The license fees will probably be to cover the shared operating expenses of the league, not the utterly fictious valutation of a license nominated by the AL which is copying the MLS's ponzi scheme as well as a street vendor's Rollex. This is their last gasp attempt to suck out whatever latent investment is around before they have a choice with the extremely high cost AL and the low buy in NSD. Anyone with that sort of play money isn't going to scare themselves into paying 30 million to meet AL's deadline. Boiler room bullshit.
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Butler99
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 1K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. For the good of the game we need both a 16 pro club ALM and a 16 club NSTM with pro players in it. Eventually I would like to see a semi pro national third tier men's competition as well. I expect at that stage the bulk of the sponsorship revenue will be gobbled up by the three national tiers so the state competitions will become semi amateur and movement between the state competitions and the national tiers will become a matter of replacing a failed national competition club or a move to increase the number of clubs in each tier. I would expect that long term the three national competitions would each become more professional rather than more revenue finding its way to the state leagues. Because football is so low in the food chain I don't think we will ever be able to afford a fully open pyramid and have the upper tiers at the standard necessary to develop our players and our national teams to the standard we want. If we end up with the ALM having 18 clubs, the ALM2 having 20 clubs and the ALM3 having 22 clubs, or more if its is split into two conferences, and all the tiers are professional and involve P/R we would be in football heaven compared to where we are now. 32 top flight teams sounds incredible but my point is the lack of clarity and direction with all of this, all parties need to come together including the state feds and create a blueprint of what the actual pyramid is going to look like from a player at the grassroots to the top of the food chain with the a-league. Im sure the APL have ambitions to grow as well but not to the determent of the NSD where its to help grow the pie outside of the NPL system which is large in itself. Ah so thats why Danny Trashcan wants to be consulted on the NST?? hahahah cmon man only time the McDonalds Pty Ltd head office ever bothered with Bob's Burger shack down the street was to see what they could do to shut it down.and pinch it's customers... :) Or do you still think they are interested ONLY in providing nutritous meals to starving families and improving the wealth and well being of its customers? He's so slimy. I remember someone called him out on Twitter once as to why he was concerning himself about the 2nd Division and his generic for the greater good betterment for Australian football was transparent. An APL does not want a strong 2nd Divsion or for that matter any division in Australian football if it disrupt the feeble monopoly that they currently enjoy on Australian top flight football. Exactly..... Just like his 3 month Youth League res-erection idea..... its all reactionary stuff to stop this "rival" league at any cost.... Good news is that the more noise they make the more fear they must have of it succeeding :) To be fair the NYL existed pre COVID. And there has been a big push by the club's to get it reinstated. To give the younger player a full 12 calendar of football. At the clubs request the NYL was cut back from an 18 round competition with a finals series to an 8 round conference style competition with a grand final 4 years before covid stopped it. The reason for cutting it back was twofold. The first was to reduce travelling costs and the second was that it wasn't needed now the clubs had teams in the NPL. After covid the APL decided to defer restarting it. The only push to restart it now appears to have come since the EOI for the winter season NST was announced. One wonders why there was a change of mind. Incorrect. There has definitely been a push for it from the club's. Especially the football departments. Players that don't play need the game time and the youth players need the extra games in the NYL. This has occurred since normality has resumed and the COVID stupidity has finally ended. But it was too soon and still some uncertainty for it to be implemented for 22/23 season. But yes. The 22-30 NPL games they get plus 8-10 NYL games is ideal for the youth players. Internally the club's believe this is a requirement.
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Flytox
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 413,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. For the good of the game we need both a 16 pro club ALM and a 16 club NSTM with pro players in it. Eventually I would like to see a semi pro national third tier men's competition as well. I expect at that stage the bulk of the sponsorship revenue will be gobbled up by the three national tiers so the state competitions will become semi amateur and movement between the state competitions and the national tiers will become a matter of replacing a failed national competition club or a move to increase the number of clubs in each tier. I would expect that long term the three national competitions would each become more professional rather than more revenue finding its way to the state leagues. Because football is so low in the food chain I don't think we will ever be able to afford a fully open pyramid and have the upper tiers at the standard necessary to develop our players and our national teams to the standard we want. If we end up with the ALM having 18 clubs, the ALM2 having 20 clubs and the ALM3 having 22 clubs, or more if its is split into two conferences, and all the tiers are professional and involve P/R we would be in football heaven compared to where we are now. 32 top flight teams sounds incredible but my point is the lack of clarity and direction with all of this, all parties need to come together including the state feds and create a blueprint of what the actual pyramid is going to look like from a player at the grassroots to the top of the food chain with the a-league. Im sure the APL have ambitions to grow as well but not to the determent of the NSD where its to help grow the pie outside of the NPL system which is large in itself. Ah so thats why Danny Trashcan wants to be consulted on the NST?? hahahah cmon man only time the McDonalds Pty Ltd head office ever bothered with Bob's Burger shack down the street was to see what they could do to shut it down.and pinch it's customers... :) Or do you still think they are interested ONLY in providing nutritous meals to starving families and improving the wealth and well being of its customers? He's so slimy. I remember someone called him out on Twitter once as to why he was concerning himself about the 2nd Division and his generic for the greater good betterment for Australian football was transparent. An APL does not want a strong 2nd Divsion or for that matter any division in Australian football if it disrupt the feeble monopoly that they currently enjoy on Australian top flight football. Exactly..... Just like his 3 month Youth League res-erection idea..... its all reactionary stuff to stop this "rival" league at any cost.... Good news is that the more noise they make the more fear they must have of it succeeding :) To be fair the NYL existed pre COVID. And there has been a big push by the club's to get it reinstated. To give the younger player a full 12 calendar of football. At the clubs request the NYL was cut back from an 18 round competition with a finals series to an 8 round conference style competition with a grand final 4 years before covid stopped it. The reason for cutting it back was twofold. The first was to reduce travelling costs and the second was that it wasn't needed now the clubs had teams in the NPL. After covid the APL decided to defer restarting it. The only push to restart it now appears to have come since the EOI for the winter season NST was announced. One wonders why there was a change of mind.
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Butler99
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 1K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. For the good of the game we need both a 16 pro club ALM and a 16 club NSTM with pro players in it. Eventually I would like to see a semi pro national third tier men's competition as well. I expect at that stage the bulk of the sponsorship revenue will be gobbled up by the three national tiers so the state competitions will become semi amateur and movement between the state competitions and the national tiers will become a matter of replacing a failed national competition club or a move to increase the number of clubs in each tier. I would expect that long term the three national competitions would each become more professional rather than more revenue finding its way to the state leagues. Because football is so low in the food chain I don't think we will ever be able to afford a fully open pyramid and have the upper tiers at the standard necessary to develop our players and our national teams to the standard we want. If we end up with the ALM having 18 clubs, the ALM2 having 20 clubs and the ALM3 having 22 clubs, or more if its is split into two conferences, and all the tiers are professional and involve P/R we would be in football heaven compared to where we are now. 32 top flight teams sounds incredible but my point is the lack of clarity and direction with all of this, all parties need to come together including the state feds and create a blueprint of what the actual pyramid is going to look like from a player at the grassroots to the top of the food chain with the a-league. Im sure the APL have ambitions to grow as well but not to the determent of the NSD where its to help grow the pie outside of the NPL system which is large in itself. Ah so thats why Danny Trashcan wants to be consulted on the NST?? hahahah cmon man only time the McDonalds Pty Ltd head office ever bothered with Bob's Burger shack down the street was to see what they could do to shut it down.and pinch it's customers... :) Or do you still think they are interested ONLY in providing nutritous meals to starving families and improving the wealth and well being of its customers? He's so slimy. I remember someone called him out on Twitter once as to why he was concerning himself about the 2nd Division and his generic for the greater good betterment for Australian football was transparent. An APL does not want a strong 2nd Divsion or for that matter any division in Australian football if it disrupt the feeble monopoly that they currently enjoy on Australian top flight football. Exactly..... Just like his 3 month Youth League res-erection idea..... its all reactionary stuff to stop this "rival" league at any cost.... Good news is that the more noise they make the more fear they must have of it succeeding :) To be fair the NYL existed pre COVID. And there has been a big push by the club's to get it reinstated. To give the younger player a full 12 calendar of football.
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Squidley
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 139,
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Not sure if this is the right thread for it, but a 16 team A-league is just way too many.
There is not enough talent in this country to keep this league at a high level whilst populating 16 professional teams.
14 should be the absolute maximum in the top flight.
Also, i presume the two teams being added in 24/25 and the two teams being added in 25/26 means a 30 round season. When is this being played?? It rules out summer entirely as you can't squeeze this many games into this schedule over summer. You will be starting and finishing during AFL and NRL seasons.
Start season 23/24 earlier and finish earlier, and then even earlier again in 24/25 and then have a proper winter season from 2025 onwards.
You are entirely better off ripping off the bandaid and going fully winter. Align the season with Jleague, Kleague and the MLS.
This league needs to stop trying to be something its not, at the detriment of something it could be
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAs there is a desire to create pro/rel between the lower tiers (first), there had better be a third tier or the teams cannot be promoted and also relegated to anywhere. Prior to 1977, there existed (at least in Vic) a top tier involving the State League and 4 Divisions below it. All 5 tiers of comps were under the P&R system. So 1 team starting in Division 4 could after 5 years theoretically end up playing in the top flight if they won the title 4 consecutive years in a row. This worked well as comps immediately above and below each other did not have a massive gulf in standard between them, although between the State League (who were semi professional) and Division 1 there was a bigger difference, albeit not as much as between the A-League and the NPL now. To make the P&R system work satisfactorily now, it has to have better equity in standards throughout. The NST is small step that will boost short term interests for a few clubs but not for the majority. Even if it does work, it may not be enough for it to continue, as was the case with the introduction of a break-away league called the NSL. It is good we are to have a strong 2nd tier, however I wouldn't be popping champagne bottles over P&R just yet. We may never see it in its purist format. Is there really that much of a disparity between the 16th best team outside of the A-League and the 17th best team? I doubt it. Let's say NSW ends up with 5 teams in the NSD: APIA, Marconi, Olympic, SUFC and Wollongong. That means that teams like Manly, Rockdale and Blacktown would still be in the NSWPL. I imagine they could all make the step up to an NSD without too much issue. Same goes with Victoria. After South, Knights, Bergers and Preston (for example), you then have Avondale, Oakleigh, Bentleigh, Hume knocking at the door. Or QLD: any of Pen Power, Lions, City, GCU or Olympic could compete, but only 2 or 3 probably will, the others will have to aim for promotion. So the transition won't be too much a gulf in class. It could be further smoothed out (eventually) by a third tier divided into north and south conferences. With a professional NST as has been proposed, the gulf between the ALM and NST won't be much at at all. That's the good bit. The bad bit is that there will be a definite gulf between the NST and any third tier and lower. It will be a long, long time before we'll see, if at all, a professional 3rd tier to bridge the gap. P&R will therefore never work as well as it did during the state league era. Even then it was canned.I don't for one minute, want to undervalue the worth of the NST as it is a great step for Australian football. But P&R will be disappointing due to these gaps in standard. When did p/r get canned at State league level? The top flight era for the state leagues finished in 1977. That's when the football authorities canned it in top flight within the new NSL comp. The A league can stand alone like a mouldy, forgotten lump pf cheese at the back of the fridge with its feral bucket, pant pissing fans, its violence and its generic franchises... These guys have paid a motza to join the ponzi scheme I dont begrudge them their stand alone competition... You know what's funny? You keep making excuses lately for the NST and their proposed closed shop and wishing to see things half full and trusting they will change after a few years (a few years of unrecoverable money down the drain where they won't want upstarts coming in for free) and preferring something over nothing etc etc etc You sound so much like a "plasticA-League fan" back in the day lately but you don't see it. I promise you thi thought mate, I wont be still going to Lakeside 18 years later if we are still playing ina closed shop league against the same boring clubs. Seriously? You will stop supporting your club over a decision made by administrators? Interesting Yeah mate, probably  I always knew it. Between the Liverpool support, the going against P/R the second your club gets a chance etc etc etc Oh FFS. hahahahahahahahha at least make me a little taller. hahahahahahahaha ha ha no!  Dude ...... I don't roll like that.... Thanks for the offer though Im flattered :P hahahahahahahah
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Davide82
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 12K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAs there is a desire to create pro/rel between the lower tiers (first), there had better be a third tier or the teams cannot be promoted and also relegated to anywhere. Prior to 1977, there existed (at least in Vic) a top tier involving the State League and 4 Divisions below it. All 5 tiers of comps were under the P&R system. So 1 team starting in Division 4 could after 5 years theoretically end up playing in the top flight if they won the title 4 consecutive years in a row. This worked well as comps immediately above and below each other did not have a massive gulf in standard between them, although between the State League (who were semi professional) and Division 1 there was a bigger difference, albeit not as much as between the A-League and the NPL now. To make the P&R system work satisfactorily now, it has to have better equity in standards throughout. The NST is small step that will boost short term interests for a few clubs but not for the majority. Even if it does work, it may not be enough for it to continue, as was the case with the introduction of a break-away league called the NSL. It is good we are to have a strong 2nd tier, however I wouldn't be popping champagne bottles over P&R just yet. We may never see it in its purist format. Is there really that much of a disparity between the 16th best team outside of the A-League and the 17th best team? I doubt it. Let's say NSW ends up with 5 teams in the NSD: APIA, Marconi, Olympic, SUFC and Wollongong. That means that teams like Manly, Rockdale and Blacktown would still be in the NSWPL. I imagine they could all make the step up to an NSD without too much issue. Same goes with Victoria. After South, Knights, Bergers and Preston (for example), you then have Avondale, Oakleigh, Bentleigh, Hume knocking at the door. Or QLD: any of Pen Power, Lions, City, GCU or Olympic could compete, but only 2 or 3 probably will, the others will have to aim for promotion. So the transition won't be too much a gulf in class. It could be further smoothed out (eventually) by a third tier divided into north and south conferences. With a professional NST as has been proposed, the gulf between the ALM and NST won't be much at at all. That's the good bit. The bad bit is that there will be a definite gulf between the NST and any third tier and lower. It will be a long, long time before we'll see, if at all, a professional 3rd tier to bridge the gap. P&R will therefore never work as well as it did during the state league era. Even then it was canned.I don't for one minute, want to undervalue the worth of the NST as it is a great step for Australian football. But P&R will be disappointing due to these gaps in standard. When did p/r get canned at State league level? The top flight era for the state leagues finished in 1977. That's when the football authorities canned it in top flight within the new NSL comp. The A league can stand alone like a mouldy, forgotten lump pf cheese at the back of the fridge with its feral bucket, pant pissing fans, its violence and its generic franchises... These guys have paid a motza to join the ponzi scheme I dont begrudge them their stand alone competition... You know what's funny? You keep making excuses lately for the NST and their proposed closed shop and wishing to see things half full and trusting they will change after a few years (a few years of unrecoverable money down the drain where they won't want upstarts coming in for free) and preferring something over nothing etc etc etc You sound so much like a "plasticA-League fan" back in the day lately but you don't see it. I promise you thi thought mate, I wont be still going to Lakeside 18 years later if we are still playing ina closed shop league against the same boring clubs. Seriously? You will stop supporting your club over a decision made by administrators? Interesting Yeah mate, probably I always knew it. Between the Liverpool support, the going against P/R the second your club gets a chance etc etc etc Oh FFS. hahahahahahahahha at least make me a little taller. hahahahahahahaha ha ha no!
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAs there is a desire to create pro/rel between the lower tiers (first), there had better be a third tier or the teams cannot be promoted and also relegated to anywhere. Prior to 1977, there existed (at least in Vic) a top tier involving the State League and 4 Divisions below it. All 5 tiers of comps were under the P&R system. So 1 team starting in Division 4 could after 5 years theoretically end up playing in the top flight if they won the title 4 consecutive years in a row. This worked well as comps immediately above and below each other did not have a massive gulf in standard between them, although between the State League (who were semi professional) and Division 1 there was a bigger difference, albeit not as much as between the A-League and the NPL now. To make the P&R system work satisfactorily now, it has to have better equity in standards throughout. The NST is small step that will boost short term interests for a few clubs but not for the majority. Even if it does work, it may not be enough for it to continue, as was the case with the introduction of a break-away league called the NSL. It is good we are to have a strong 2nd tier, however I wouldn't be popping champagne bottles over P&R just yet. We may never see it in its purist format. Is there really that much of a disparity between the 16th best team outside of the A-League and the 17th best team? I doubt it. Let's say NSW ends up with 5 teams in the NSD: APIA, Marconi, Olympic, SUFC and Wollongong. That means that teams like Manly, Rockdale and Blacktown would still be in the NSWPL. I imagine they could all make the step up to an NSD without too much issue. Same goes with Victoria. After South, Knights, Bergers and Preston (for example), you then have Avondale, Oakleigh, Bentleigh, Hume knocking at the door. Or QLD: any of Pen Power, Lions, City, GCU or Olympic could compete, but only 2 or 3 probably will, the others will have to aim for promotion. So the transition won't be too much a gulf in class. It could be further smoothed out (eventually) by a third tier divided into north and south conferences. With a professional NST as has been proposed, the gulf between the ALM and NST won't be much at at all. That's the good bit. The bad bit is that there will be a definite gulf between the NST and any third tier and lower. It will be a long, long time before we'll see, if at all, a professional 3rd tier to bridge the gap. P&R will therefore never work as well as it did during the state league era. Even then it was canned.I don't for one minute, want to undervalue the worth of the NST as it is a great step for Australian football. But P&R will be disappointing due to these gaps in standard. When did p/r get canned at State league level? The top flight era for the state leagues finished in 1977. That's when the football authorities canned it in top flight within the new NSL comp. The A league can stand alone like a mouldy, forgotten lump pf cheese at the back of the fridge with its feral bucket, pant pissing fans, its violence and its generic franchises... These guys have paid a motza to join the ponzi scheme I dont begrudge them their stand alone competition... You know what's funny? You keep making excuses lately for the NST and their proposed closed shop and wishing to see things half full and trusting they will change after a few years (a few years of unrecoverable money down the drain where they won't want upstarts coming in for free) and preferring something over nothing etc etc etc You sound so much like a "plasticA-League fan" back in the day lately but you don't see it. I promise you thi thought mate, I wont be still going to Lakeside 18 years later if we are still playing ina closed shop league against the same boring clubs. Seriously? You will stop supporting your club over a decision made by administrators? Interesting Yeah mate, probably I always knew it. Between the Liverpool support, the going against P/R the second your club gets a chance etc etc etc Oh FFS. hahahahahahahahha at least make me a little taller. hahahahahahahaha
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
Visits: 0
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+xI don't get it. You made it sound like this was a tv deal? Wishful thinking I guess.... :)
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Davide82
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 12K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAs there is a desire to create pro/rel between the lower tiers (first), there had better be a third tier or the teams cannot be promoted and also relegated to anywhere. Prior to 1977, there existed (at least in Vic) a top tier involving the State League and 4 Divisions below it. All 5 tiers of comps were under the P&R system. So 1 team starting in Division 4 could after 5 years theoretically end up playing in the top flight if they won the title 4 consecutive years in a row. This worked well as comps immediately above and below each other did not have a massive gulf in standard between them, although between the State League (who were semi professional) and Division 1 there was a bigger difference, albeit not as much as between the A-League and the NPL now. To make the P&R system work satisfactorily now, it has to have better equity in standards throughout. The NST is small step that will boost short term interests for a few clubs but not for the majority. Even if it does work, it may not be enough for it to continue, as was the case with the introduction of a break-away league called the NSL. It is good we are to have a strong 2nd tier, however I wouldn't be popping champagne bottles over P&R just yet. We may never see it in its purist format. Is there really that much of a disparity between the 16th best team outside of the A-League and the 17th best team? I doubt it. Let's say NSW ends up with 5 teams in the NSD: APIA, Marconi, Olympic, SUFC and Wollongong. That means that teams like Manly, Rockdale and Blacktown would still be in the NSWPL. I imagine they could all make the step up to an NSD without too much issue. Same goes with Victoria. After South, Knights, Bergers and Preston (for example), you then have Avondale, Oakleigh, Bentleigh, Hume knocking at the door. Or QLD: any of Pen Power, Lions, City, GCU or Olympic could compete, but only 2 or 3 probably will, the others will have to aim for promotion. So the transition won't be too much a gulf in class. It could be further smoothed out (eventually) by a third tier divided into north and south conferences. With a professional NST as has been proposed, the gulf between the ALM and NST won't be much at at all. That's the good bit. The bad bit is that there will be a definite gulf between the NST and any third tier and lower. It will be a long, long time before we'll see, if at all, a professional 3rd tier to bridge the gap. P&R will therefore never work as well as it did during the state league era. Even then it was canned.I don't for one minute, want to undervalue the worth of the NST as it is a great step for Australian football. But P&R will be disappointing due to these gaps in standard. When did p/r get canned at State league level? The top flight era for the state leagues finished in 1977. That's when the football authorities canned it in top flight within the new NSL comp. The A league can stand alone like a mouldy, forgotten lump pf cheese at the back of the fridge with its feral bucket, pant pissing fans, its violence and its generic franchises... These guys have paid a motza to join the ponzi scheme I dont begrudge them their stand alone competition... You know what's funny? You keep making excuses lately for the NST and their proposed closed shop and wishing to see things half full and trusting they will change after a few years (a few years of unrecoverable money down the drain where they won't want upstarts coming in for free) and preferring something over nothing etc etc etc You sound so much like a "plasticA-League fan" back in the day lately but you don't see it. I promise you thi thought mate, I wont be still going to Lakeside 18 years later if we are still playing ina closed shop league against the same boring clubs. Seriously? You will stop supporting your club over a decision made by administrators? Interesting Yeah mate, probably I always knew it. Between the Liverpool support, the going against P/R the second your club gets a chance etc etc etc
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Davide82
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 12K,
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I don't get it. You made it sound like this was a tv deal?
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Monoethnic Social Club
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OLE, OLE, OLE, OLE, OLE, OPTUSSSSS, OPTUUUSSSS https://twitter.com/OptusSport/status/1626398939716128768?cxt=HHwWgMDQjf_NkJItAAAALess than 24 hours after Silverfox garbage channel 10 poo pooos the NST along comes this little beauty... NST and EPL and La Liga on one service.... Fuck me, get Serie A and Greek Suoer league as well and I may never get off the coach again...........
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Monoethnic Social Club
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAs there is a desire to create pro/rel between the lower tiers (first), there had better be a third tier or the teams cannot be promoted and also relegated to anywhere. Prior to 1977, there existed (at least in Vic) a top tier involving the State League and 4 Divisions below it. All 5 tiers of comps were under the P&R system. So 1 team starting in Division 4 could after 5 years theoretically end up playing in the top flight if they won the title 4 consecutive years in a row. This worked well as comps immediately above and below each other did not have a massive gulf in standard between them, although between the State League (who were semi professional) and Division 1 there was a bigger difference, albeit not as much as between the A-League and the NPL now. To make the P&R system work satisfactorily now, it has to have better equity in standards throughout. The NST is small step that will boost short term interests for a few clubs but not for the majority. Even if it does work, it may not be enough for it to continue, as was the case with the introduction of a break-away league called the NSL. It is good we are to have a strong 2nd tier, however I wouldn't be popping champagne bottles over P&R just yet. We may never see it in its purist format. Is there really that much of a disparity between the 16th best team outside of the A-League and the 17th best team? I doubt it. Let's say NSW ends up with 5 teams in the NSD: APIA, Marconi, Olympic, SUFC and Wollongong. That means that teams like Manly, Rockdale and Blacktown would still be in the NSWPL. I imagine they could all make the step up to an NSD without too much issue. Same goes with Victoria. After South, Knights, Bergers and Preston (for example), you then have Avondale, Oakleigh, Bentleigh, Hume knocking at the door. Or QLD: any of Pen Power, Lions, City, GCU or Olympic could compete, but only 2 or 3 probably will, the others will have to aim for promotion. So the transition won't be too much a gulf in class. It could be further smoothed out (eventually) by a third tier divided into north and south conferences. With a professional NST as has been proposed, the gulf between the ALM and NST won't be much at at all. That's the good bit. The bad bit is that there will be a definite gulf between the NST and any third tier and lower. It will be a long, long time before we'll see, if at all, a professional 3rd tier to bridge the gap. P&R will therefore never work as well as it did during the state league era. Even then it was canned.I don't for one minute, want to undervalue the worth of the NST as it is a great step for Australian football. But P&R will be disappointing due to these gaps in standard. When did p/r get canned at State league level? The top flight era for the state leagues finished in 1977. That's when the football authorities canned it in top flight within the new NSL comp. The A league can stand alone like a mouldy, forgotten lump pf cheese at the back of the fridge with its feral bucket, pant pissing fans, its violence and its generic franchises... These guys have paid a motza to join the ponzi scheme I dont begrudge them their stand alone competition... You know what's funny? You keep making excuses lately for the NST and their proposed closed shop and wishing to see things half full and trusting they will change after a few years (a few years of unrecoverable money down the drain where they won't want upstarts coming in for free) and preferring something over nothing etc etc etc You sound so much like a "plasticA-League fan" back in the day lately but you don't see it. I promise you thi thought mate, I wont be still going to Lakeside 18 years later if we are still playing ina closed shop league against the same boring clubs. Seriously? You will stop supporting your club over a decision made by administrators? Interesting Yeah mate, probably.... after year upon year of having nothing to play for, where win lose or draw nothing matters, what would be the point?
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Davide82
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 12K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAs there is a desire to create pro/rel between the lower tiers (first), there had better be a third tier or the teams cannot be promoted and also relegated to anywhere. Prior to 1977, there existed (at least in Vic) a top tier involving the State League and 4 Divisions below it. All 5 tiers of comps were under the P&R system. So 1 team starting in Division 4 could after 5 years theoretically end up playing in the top flight if they won the title 4 consecutive years in a row. This worked well as comps immediately above and below each other did not have a massive gulf in standard between them, although between the State League (who were semi professional) and Division 1 there was a bigger difference, albeit not as much as between the A-League and the NPL now. To make the P&R system work satisfactorily now, it has to have better equity in standards throughout. The NST is small step that will boost short term interests for a few clubs but not for the majority. Even if it does work, it may not be enough for it to continue, as was the case with the introduction of a break-away league called the NSL. It is good we are to have a strong 2nd tier, however I wouldn't be popping champagne bottles over P&R just yet. We may never see it in its purist format. Is there really that much of a disparity between the 16th best team outside of the A-League and the 17th best team? I doubt it. Let's say NSW ends up with 5 teams in the NSD: APIA, Marconi, Olympic, SUFC and Wollongong. That means that teams like Manly, Rockdale and Blacktown would still be in the NSWPL. I imagine they could all make the step up to an NSD without too much issue. Same goes with Victoria. After South, Knights, Bergers and Preston (for example), you then have Avondale, Oakleigh, Bentleigh, Hume knocking at the door. Or QLD: any of Pen Power, Lions, City, GCU or Olympic could compete, but only 2 or 3 probably will, the others will have to aim for promotion. So the transition won't be too much a gulf in class. It could be further smoothed out (eventually) by a third tier divided into north and south conferences. With a professional NST as has been proposed, the gulf between the ALM and NST won't be much at at all. That's the good bit. The bad bit is that there will be a definite gulf between the NST and any third tier and lower. It will be a long, long time before we'll see, if at all, a professional 3rd tier to bridge the gap. P&R will therefore never work as well as it did during the state league era. Even then it was canned.I don't for one minute, want to undervalue the worth of the NST as it is a great step for Australian football. But P&R will be disappointing due to these gaps in standard. When did p/r get canned at State league level? The top flight era for the state leagues finished in 1977. That's when the football authorities canned it in top flight within the new NSL comp. The A league can stand alone like a mouldy, forgotten lump pf cheese at the back of the fridge with its feral bucket, pant pissing fans, its violence and its generic franchises... These guys have paid a motza to join the ponzi scheme I dont begrudge them their stand alone competition... You know what's funny? You keep making excuses lately for the NST and their proposed closed shop and wishing to see things half full and trusting they will change after a few years (a few years of unrecoverable money down the drain where they won't want upstarts coming in for free) and preferring something over nothing etc etc etc You sound so much like a "plasticA-League fan" back in the day lately but you don't see it. I promise you thi thought mate, I wont be still going to Lakeside 18 years later if we are still playing ina closed shop league against the same boring clubs. Seriously? You will stop supporting your club over a decision made by administrators? Interesting
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
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+x+x+x+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. For the good of the game we need both a 16 pro club ALM and a 16 club NSTM with pro players in it. Eventually I would like to see a semi pro national third tier men's competition as well. I expect at that stage the bulk of the sponsorship revenue will be gobbled up by the three national tiers so the state competitions will become semi amateur and movement between the state competitions and the national tiers will become a matter of replacing a failed national competition club or a move to increase the number of clubs in each tier. I would expect that long term the three national competitions would each become more professional rather than more revenue finding its way to the state leagues. Because football is so low in the food chain I don't think we will ever be able to afford a fully open pyramid and have the upper tiers at the standard necessary to develop our players and our national teams to the standard we want. If we end up with the ALM having 18 clubs, the ALM2 having 20 clubs and the ALM3 having 22 clubs, or more if its is split into two conferences, and all the tiers are professional and involve P/R we would be in football heaven compared to where we are now. 32 top flight teams sounds incredible but my point is the lack of clarity and direction with all of this, all parties need to come together including the state feds and create a blueprint of what the actual pyramid is going to look like from a player at the grassroots to the top of the food chain with the a-league. Im sure the APL have ambitions to grow as well but not to the determent of the NSD where its to help grow the pie outside of the NPL system which is large in itself. I think it is quite clear. The NPL will continue as is, the NST will be established and the ALM will grow. I'm not sure what more you want. How it all works together is part of FA's role. No one else has carriage of the strategic direction of football. What level of consultation FA does to engage the stakeholders time will tell. Perfectly said...... APL on the other hand is interested ONLY in 10 owners and their return on investment........
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
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+x+x+x+x+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. For the good of the game we need both a 16 pro club ALM and a 16 club NSTM with pro players in it. Eventually I would like to see a semi pro national third tier men's competition as well. I expect at that stage the bulk of the sponsorship revenue will be gobbled up by the three national tiers so the state competitions will become semi amateur and movement between the state competitions and the national tiers will become a matter of replacing a failed national competition club or a move to increase the number of clubs in each tier. I would expect that long term the three national competitions would each become more professional rather than more revenue finding its way to the state leagues. Because football is so low in the food chain I don't think we will ever be able to afford a fully open pyramid and have the upper tiers at the standard necessary to develop our players and our national teams to the standard we want. If we end up with the ALM having 18 clubs, the ALM2 having 20 clubs and the ALM3 having 22 clubs, or more if its is split into two conferences, and all the tiers are professional and involve P/R we would be in football heaven compared to where we are now. 32 top flight teams sounds incredible but my point is the lack of clarity and direction with all of this, all parties need to come together including the state feds and create a blueprint of what the actual pyramid is going to look like from a player at the grassroots to the top of the food chain with the a-league. Im sure the APL have ambitions to grow as well but not to the determent of the NSD where its to help grow the pie outside of the NPL system which is large in itself. Ah so thats why Danny Trashcan wants to be consulted on the NST?? hahahah cmon man only time the McDonalds Pty Ltd head office ever bothered with Bob's Burger shack down the street was to see what they could do to shut it down.and pinch it's customers... :) Or do you still think they are interested ONLY in providing nutritous meals to starving families and improving the wealth and well being of its customers? He's so slimy. I remember someone called him out on Twitter once as to why he was concerning himself about the 2nd Division and his generic for the greater good betterment for Australian football was transparent. An APL does not want a strong 2nd Divsion or for that matter any division in Australian football if it disrupt the feeble monopoly that they currently enjoy on Australian top flight football. Exactly..... Just like his 3 month Youth League res-erection idea..... its all reactionary stuff to stop this "rival" league at any cost.... Good news is that the more noise they make the more fear they must have of it succeeding :)
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ErogenousZone
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4.6K,
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+x+x+x+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. For the good of the game we need both a 16 pro club ALM and a 16 club NSTM with pro players in it. Eventually I would like to see a semi pro national third tier men's competition as well. I expect at that stage the bulk of the sponsorship revenue will be gobbled up by the three national tiers so the state competitions will become semi amateur and movement between the state competitions and the national tiers will become a matter of replacing a failed national competition club or a move to increase the number of clubs in each tier. I would expect that long term the three national competitions would each become more professional rather than more revenue finding its way to the state leagues. Because football is so low in the food chain I don't think we will ever be able to afford a fully open pyramid and have the upper tiers at the standard necessary to develop our players and our national teams to the standard we want. If we end up with the ALM having 18 clubs, the ALM2 having 20 clubs and the ALM3 having 22 clubs, or more if its is split into two conferences, and all the tiers are professional and involve P/R we would be in football heaven compared to where we are now. 32 top flight teams sounds incredible but my point is the lack of clarity and direction with all of this, all parties need to come together including the state feds and create a blueprint of what the actual pyramid is going to look like from a player at the grassroots to the top of the food chain with the a-league. Im sure the APL have ambitions to grow as well but not to the determent of the NSD where its to help grow the pie outside of the NPL system which is large in itself. Ah so thats why Danny Trashcan wants to be consulted on the NST?? hahahah cmon man only time the McDonalds Pty Ltd head office ever bothered with Bob's Burger shack down the street was to see what they could do to shut it down.and pinch it's customers... :) Or do you still think they are interested ONLY in providing nutritous meals to starving families and improving the wealth and well being of its customers? He's so slimy. I remember someone called him out on Twitter once as to why he was concerning himself about the 2nd Division and his generic for the greater good betterment for Australian football was transparent. An APL does not want a strong 2nd Divsion or for that matter any division in Australian football if it disrupt the feeble monopoly that they currently enjoy on Australian top flight football.
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Flytox
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 413,
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+x+x+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. For the good of the game we need both a 16 pro club ALM and a 16 club NSTM with pro players in it. Eventually I would like to see a semi pro national third tier men's competition as well. I expect at that stage the bulk of the sponsorship revenue will be gobbled up by the three national tiers so the state competitions will become semi amateur and movement between the state competitions and the national tiers will become a matter of replacing a failed national competition club or a move to increase the number of clubs in each tier. I would expect that long term the three national competitions would each become more professional rather than more revenue finding its way to the state leagues. Because football is so low in the food chain I don't think we will ever be able to afford a fully open pyramid and have the upper tiers at the standard necessary to develop our players and our national teams to the standard we want. If we end up with the ALM having 18 clubs, the ALM2 having 20 clubs and the ALM3 having 22 clubs, or more if its is split into two conferences, and all the tiers are professional and involve P/R we would be in football heaven compared to where we are now. 32 top flight teams sounds incredible but my point is the lack of clarity and direction with all of this, all parties need to come together including the state feds and create a blueprint of what the actual pyramid is going to look like from a player at the grassroots to the top of the food chain with the a-league. Im sure the APL have ambitions to grow as well but not to the determent of the NSD where its to help grow the pie outside of the NPL system which is large in itself. I think it is quite clear. The NPL will continue as is, the NST will be established and the ALM will grow. I'm not sure what more you want. How it all works together is part of FA's role. No one else has carriage of the strategic direction of football. What level of consultation FA does to engage the stakeholders time will tell.
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. For the good of the game we need both a 16 pro club ALM and a 16 club NSTM with pro players in it. Eventually I would like to see a semi pro national third tier men's competition as well. I expect at that stage the bulk of the sponsorship revenue will be gobbled up by the three national tiers so the state competitions will become semi amateur and movement between the state competitions and the national tiers will become a matter of replacing a failed national competition club or a move to increase the number of clubs in each tier. I would expect that long term the three national competitions would each become more professional rather than more revenue finding its way to the state leagues. Because football is so low in the food chain I don't think we will ever be able to afford a fully open pyramid and have the upper tiers at the standard necessary to develop our players and our national teams to the standard we want. If we end up with the ALM having 18 clubs, the ALM2 having 20 clubs and the ALM3 having 22 clubs, or more if its is split into two conferences, and all the tiers are professional and involve P/R we would be in football heaven compared to where we are now. 32 top flight teams sounds incredible but my point is the lack of clarity and direction with all of this, all parties need to come together including the state feds and create a blueprint of what the actual pyramid is going to look like from a player at the grassroots to the top of the food chain with the a-league. Im sure the APL have ambitions to grow as well but not to the determent of the NSD where its to help grow the pie outside of the NPL system which is large in itself. Ah so thats why Danny Trashcan wants to be consulted on the NST?? hahahah cmon man only time the McDonalds Pty Ltd head office ever bothered with Bob's Burger shack down the street was to see what they could do to shut it down.and pinch it's customers... :) Or do you still think they are interested ONLY in providing nutritous meals to starving families and improving the wealth and well being of its customers?
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
Visits: 0
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+x+x+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. Surely its just a massive coincidence that despite talk of "stabilisation of the league", "shoring up the finance of the exiting franchise before looking to expand" and "capitalising on marketing and boradcasting to bring new fans to exisiting product" the new APL mantra is "Hey any potential football loving investors or sponsors, fuck the NST clubs look over here.... we are going to expand the Aleague to 16 x clubs ... get yourself a license while they are sooooo in demend? hahahahahahahahah mate its pretty clearly OVER... there is no more hope of US, its US vs THEM whichever side you are on.... choose wisely. US vs THEM wont cut it mate, the game needs to be more mature than this which is why a more clear direction is needed here. An more unified game will make the game more successful, so I dont know why anyone would be against that? Brother I am NOT against it.... Cold hard reality though is that US vs THEM = Members owned (non private clubs) vs Franchises with ownership groups that have paid an exorbitant amount of money just for a license to operate... and who can ONLY grow the pie if they can sell another license and another and another --- see MLS and PONZI scheme for clarification. Now for US vs THEM to become a whole united group then one of two things has to happen. a) Potential NST clubs and then into the future 3rd and or 4th division clubs need to be sold off to an ownership group to become private entities so that they can pay their way into the closed franchise league otherwise the franchsies (rightly so) would want they monies they have already spent to be returned to them. OR b)Current FA must insist that promotion and relegation is mandated across all levels of Australian Soccer and that Aleague clubs are NOT protected from relegation based on the fact they have paid these license fees or their geographical areas. Point a) is next to impossible to achieve,. both financially and also alot of the constitutions of these not for profit members based clubs wont allow it so I guess these clubs cant be involved. and All levels of the pyramid would need to be revamped - 1000+ clubs disbanded???? Point b) is up to the fortitude ofr the FA and how resistant the APL ownership investors are to it... I wouldn't think someone who has paid 16 million for a license to play in a closed league would be open to the possibility of not recovering that money?
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numklpkgulftumch
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 1.9K,
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+x+x+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. Surely its just a massive coincidence that despite talk of "stabilisation of the league", "shoring up the finance of the exiting franchise before looking to expand" and "capitalising on marketing and boradcasting to bring new fans to exisiting product" the new APL mantra is "Hey any potential football loving investors or sponsors, fuck the NST clubs look over here.... we are going to expand the Aleague to 16 x clubs ... get yourself a license while they are sooooo in demend? hahahahahahahahah mate its pretty clearly OVER... there is no more hope of US, its US vs THEM whichever side you are on.... choose wisely. US vs THEM wont cut it mate, the game needs to be more mature than this which is why a more clear direction is needed here. An more unified game will make the game more successful, so I dont know why anyone would be against that? Full pyramid it is then
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Barca4Life
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 13K,
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+x+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. Surely its just a massive coincidence that despite talk of "stabilisation of the league", "shoring up the finance of the exiting franchise before looking to expand" and "capitalising on marketing and boradcasting to bring new fans to exisiting product" the new APL mantra is "Hey any potential football loving investors or sponsors, fuck the NST clubs look over here.... we are going to expand the Aleague to 16 x clubs ... get yourself a license while they are sooooo in demend? hahahahahahahahah mate its pretty clearly OVER... there is no more hope of US, its US vs THEM whichever side you are on.... choose wisely. US vs THEM wont cut it mate, the game needs to be more mature than this which is why a more clear direction is needed here. An more unified game will make the game more successful, so I dont know why anyone would be against that?
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Barca4Life
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 13K,
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+x+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. For the good of the game we need both a 16 pro club ALM and a 16 club NSTM with pro players in it. Eventually I would like to see a semi pro national third tier men's competition as well. I expect at that stage the bulk of the sponsorship revenue will be gobbled up by the three national tiers so the state competitions will become semi amateur and movement between the state competitions and the national tiers will become a matter of replacing a failed national competition club or a move to increase the number of clubs in each tier. I would expect that long term the three national competitions would each become more professional rather than more revenue finding its way to the state leagues. Because football is so low in the food chain I don't think we will ever be able to afford a fully open pyramid and have the upper tiers at the standard necessary to develop our players and our national teams to the standard we want. If we end up with the ALM having 18 clubs, the ALM2 having 20 clubs and the ALM3 having 22 clubs, or more if its is split into two conferences, and all the tiers are professional and involve P/R we would be in football heaven compared to where we are now. 32 top flight teams sounds incredible but my point is the lack of clarity and direction with all of this, all parties need to come together including the state feds and create a blueprint of what the actual pyramid is going to look like from a player at the grassroots to the top of the food chain with the a-league. Im sure the APL have ambitions to grow as well but not to the determent of the NSD where its to help grow the pie outside of the NPL system which is large in itself.
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Flytox
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 413,
Visits: 0
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+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. For the good of the game we need both a 16 pro club ALM and a 16 club NSTM with pro players in it. Eventually I would like to see a semi pro national third tier men's competition as well. I expect at that stage the bulk of the sponsorship revenue will be gobbled up by the three national tiers so the state competitions will become semi amateur and movement between the state competitions and the national tiers will become a matter of replacing a failed national competition club or a move to increase the number of clubs in each tier. I would expect that long term the three national competitions would each become more professional rather than more revenue finding its way to the state leagues. Because football is so low in the food chain I don't think we will ever be able to afford a fully open pyramid and have the upper tiers at the standard necessary to develop our players and our national teams to the standard we want. If we end up with the ALM having 18 clubs, the ALM2 having 20 clubs and the ALM3 having 22 clubs, or more if its is split into two conferences, and all the tiers are professional and involve P/R we would be in football heaven compared to where we are now.
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Monoethnic Social Club
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAs there is a desire to create pro/rel between the lower tiers (first), there had better be a third tier or the teams cannot be promoted and also relegated to anywhere. Prior to 1977, there existed (at least in Vic) a top tier involving the State League and 4 Divisions below it. All 5 tiers of comps were under the P&R system. So 1 team starting in Division 4 could after 5 years theoretically end up playing in the top flight if they won the title 4 consecutive years in a row. This worked well as comps immediately above and below each other did not have a massive gulf in standard between them, although between the State League (who were semi professional) and Division 1 there was a bigger difference, albeit not as much as between the A-League and the NPL now. To make the P&R system work satisfactorily now, it has to have better equity in standards throughout. The NST is small step that will boost short term interests for a few clubs but not for the majority. Even if it does work, it may not be enough for it to continue, as was the case with the introduction of a break-away league called the NSL. It is good we are to have a strong 2nd tier, however I wouldn't be popping champagne bottles over P&R just yet. We may never see it in its purist format. Is there really that much of a disparity between the 16th best team outside of the A-League and the 17th best team? I doubt it. Let's say NSW ends up with 5 teams in the NSD: APIA, Marconi, Olympic, SUFC and Wollongong. That means that teams like Manly, Rockdale and Blacktown would still be in the NSWPL. I imagine they could all make the step up to an NSD without too much issue. Same goes with Victoria. After South, Knights, Bergers and Preston (for example), you then have Avondale, Oakleigh, Bentleigh, Hume knocking at the door. Or QLD: any of Pen Power, Lions, City, GCU or Olympic could compete, but only 2 or 3 probably will, the others will have to aim for promotion. So the transition won't be too much a gulf in class. It could be further smoothed out (eventually) by a third tier divided into north and south conferences. With a professional NST as has been proposed, the gulf between the ALM and NST won't be much at at all. That's the good bit. The bad bit is that there will be a definite gulf between the NST and any third tier and lower. It will be a long, long time before we'll see, if at all, a professional 3rd tier to bridge the gap. P&R will therefore never work as well as it did during the state league era. Even then it was canned.I don't for one minute, want to undervalue the worth of the NST as it is a great step for Australian football. But P&R will be disappointing due to these gaps in standard. When did p/r get canned at State league level? The top flight era for the state leagues finished in 1977. That's when the football authorities canned it in top flight within the new NSL comp. The A league can stand alone like a mouldy, forgotten lump pf cheese at the back of the fridge with its feral bucket, pant pissing fans, its violence and its generic franchises... These guys have paid a motza to join the ponzi scheme I dont begrudge them their stand alone competition... You know what's funny? You keep making excuses lately for the NST and their proposed closed shop and wishing to see things half full and trusting they will change after a few years (a few years of unrecoverable money down the drain where they won't want upstarts coming in for free) and preferring something over nothing etc etc etc You sound so much like a "plasticA-League fan" back in the day lately but you don't see it. You are right BTW, I guess I just want it to happen ASAP... I do really want Pro/Rel in the first season though..... no later than the second and will not be happy if a concrete timeline for this to happen isnt mandated BEFORE the first ball is kicked in anger. I promise you thi thought mate, I wont be still going to Lakeside 18 years later if we are still playing ina closed shop league against the same boring clubs.
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Monoethnic Social Club
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And another indicator, just to expand on above ... look to see what FA choses to call the actual NST competition....... This, to my mind, will be the crucial indicator as to what the future holds....
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Monoethnic Social Club
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+xThis feels like a cluster****, on one side the FA are going on with the NSD process and on the other side the APL are wanting to expand the league to 16 teams? What about a blueprint for the future of the professional game instead? Which should include the prospect of introducing promotion and relegation with all parties working together to grow the game rather than each one doing its own thing? This badly needs direction, but once again Australian football in a confused state with not only with a lack of direction but also it seems to be a lack of unity as well. Maybe we should have looked at Japan and how they did the J-League pyramid, again we don't seem keen to learn from others. Surely its just a massive coincidence that despite talk of "stabilisation of the league", "shoring up the finance of the exiting franchise before looking to expand" and "capitalising on marketing and boradcasting to bring new fans to exisiting product" the new APL mantra is "Hey any potential football loving investors or sponsors, fuck the NST clubs look over here.... we are going to expand the Aleague to 16 x clubs ... get yourself a license while they are sooooo in demend? hahahahahahahahah mate its pretty clearly OVER... there is no more hope of US, its US vs THEM whichever side you are on.... choose wisely.
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Monoethnic Social Club
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 11K,
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+x+x+x+x+x+x+x+xAs there is a desire to create pro/rel between the lower tiers (first), there had better be a third tier or the teams cannot be promoted and also relegated to anywhere. Prior to 1977, there existed (at least in Vic) a top tier involving the State League and 4 Divisions below it. All 5 tiers of comps were under the P&R system. So 1 team starting in Division 4 could after 5 years theoretically end up playing in the top flight if they won the title 4 consecutive years in a row. This worked well as comps immediately above and below each other did not have a massive gulf in standard between them, although between the State League (who were semi professional) and Division 1 there was a bigger difference, albeit not as much as between the A-League and the NPL now. To make the P&R system work satisfactorily now, it has to have better equity in standards throughout. The NST is small step that will boost short term interests for a few clubs but not for the majority. Even if it does work, it may not be enough for it to continue, as was the case with the introduction of a break-away league called the NSL. It is good we are to have a strong 2nd tier, however I wouldn't be popping champagne bottles over P&R just yet. We may never see it in its purist format. Is there really that much of a disparity between the 16th best team outside of the A-League and the 17th best team? I doubt it. Let's say NSW ends up with 5 teams in the NSD: APIA, Marconi, Olympic, SUFC and Wollongong. That means that teams like Manly, Rockdale and Blacktown would still be in the NSWPL. I imagine they could all make the step up to an NSD without too much issue. Same goes with Victoria. After South, Knights, Bergers and Preston (for example), you then have Avondale, Oakleigh, Bentleigh, Hume knocking at the door. Or QLD: any of Pen Power, Lions, City, GCU or Olympic could compete, but only 2 or 3 probably will, the others will have to aim for promotion. So the transition won't be too much a gulf in class. It could be further smoothed out (eventually) by a third tier divided into north and south conferences. With a professional NST as has been proposed, the gulf between the ALM and NST won't be much at at all. That's the good bit. The bad bit is that there will be a definite gulf between the NST and any third tier and lower. It will be a long, long time before we'll see, if at all, a professional 3rd tier to bridge the gap. P&R will therefore never work as well as it did during the state league era. Even then it was canned.I don't for one minute, want to undervalue the worth of the NST as it is a great step for Australian football. But P&R will be disappointing due to these gaps in standard. When did p/r get canned at State league level? The top flight era for the state leagues finished in 1977. That's when the football authorities canned it in top flight within the new NSL comp. The A league can stand alone like a mouldy, forgotten lump pf cheese at the back of the fridge with its feral bucket, pant pissing fans, its violence and its generic franchises... These guys have paid a motza to join the ponzi scheme I dont begrudge them their stand alone competition... You know what's funny? You keep making excuses lately for the NST and their proposed closed shop and wishing to see things half full and trusting they will change after a few years (a few years of unrecoverable money down the drain where they won't want upstarts coming in for free) and preferring something over nothing etc etc etc You sound so much like a "plasticA-League fan" back in the day lately but you don't see it. hahahaahah I know right, its like rain on your wedding day or winning the lottery only to die the next day :P
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